Intake Manifold flap lock in long position thread

A6 All/ S6 All
#21

@Kimovitzh My response to you in part was more joking and having fun. But internet makes that sometimes hard to tell.

I think if you put a functional intake on your car you would more notice the difference. If your intake was damaged for a while it’s always going to be less noticeable when you gut the intake as you already had issues. So that always plays.

Kills is probably an over statement but it really effects the car overall. The comments moxifa mentioned are standard when you have people that go from gutted to fully functional. and from seeing how a car drives with a gutted intake and a functional intake in the same hour as we had several cars in the same spot on the same day at the same time. It was noticeable enough everything from the idle to low and mid end driving. So that and the same responses everytime a gutted intake guy gets a functional intake it’s always something I try to pass on.

#22

At the moment, Malaysia. But the car is getting on a boat soon and taking a cruise to the EU.

#23

@justincredible No doubt about that, and I would love to get a new M labeled manifold.

But seeing that they also can fail after some time has put me a bit off. It’s a lot of money if it just breaks again.

And yeah, the joking flew right by me. :blush:

@mixofia Can I ask where your new location will be here in EU?

#24

Hi there. :slight_smile:

I’m new here, I couldn’t create a new topic, hope it’s OK, I write here?

I have recently bought an S6.

I have noticed a slight rattle between 1500-2000rpm from the IM.

I decided to take the IM of the car, and do a carbon clean, change all injectors seals, oil housing seals, PCV delete etc.

When I got it of the car, I noticed is was a M model form 10/2011 :grinning:

Unfortunately a small piece of the rubber is missing on one of the flaps.

flap
flap3648×2736 2.81 MB

Is it something there can be fixed, or should I just leave it, lock them down og remove all the flaps?

Next question, im planning to do a PCV delete, what are the best way to do this?

Thanks :slight_smile:

Regards
Torben, Denmark.

#25

Still shaking out the new IM mod. Generally, the engine runs very smooth as I drive like a maniac. But twice now, I got a “random misfire cyl 1 or 2” fault.

The second time was after after a reset and about 40m of driving. While it was running rough, I restarted the engine (at a stop light) and it came back smooth as silk.

Apart from a new radiator and a bunch of o-rings, the only change was the IM hack. Are these possibly air leaks through the flashing, random bits of epoxy breaking off, or ecu adaptations?

Ideas?

#26

@BANG that doesn’t look too bad. That is just the flaps getting dried out from heat cycles and then getting brittle. I don’t think you need to look out or replace anything. This is one of the reasons people suggest getting the JHM intake spacers. The spacers really help keep the heat down inside the intake. That helps stuff like you’re seeing.

As long as the other mounting points look good. I wouldn’t worry about it. check and clean your transition mounts.

While I can’t see the entire intake flaps and bits. From what I can see they all look good.

Also I DEFINITELY would NOT do a PCV delete. Its clear that from the look of your picture here it’s working as your flaps for the most part look fine and it isn’t showing signs of over oil or crud. Clean the PCV system and reinstall.

#27

Small misfires here and there are possible at anytime. If you have a vag com. Post the code data that will give a better idea on why there are misfires.

#28

Thank you for the reply :slight_smile:

I have checked all the flaps, the rubber seems ok.

I have been considering buying JHM spacers, maybe I do that on a later point!

On the picture, the intake has got a mild clean, please check the new picture below.
This is right after disassembly.

IMG_20200621_184228
IMG_20200621_1842281368×1824 1.33 MB

About the PCV system, wouldnt it be better to mount an oil catch can?
Or is it best, just clean the system and reinstall it, as you write?

I will do a heater bypass on the IM adapter, or is it also best to leave stock?

I will upload another picture of the IM and carbon clean.
BTW: After carbon clean, do you put back the spacers?

Thanks.

#29

clean
clean3648×2736 2.16 MB

#30

I wouldn’t put the port spacers back in. They just end up getting majorly clogged with carbon and lead to bigger chances of carbon chunks braking off and falling into the cylinders.

The PCV system has an oil separator. catch cans tend to be largely ineffective especially when compared to a properly working oil separator and PCV system. When you look at all of the carbon build up that is a sign of years and years of non cleaning.

If you can swing it the JHM intake spacers really help with carbon… intake temps and retention of power.

throttle body bypass is also very helpful. .

#31

Perfect, I’ll just throw them in the trash.

I will try clean the PCV separator, are there a best way to do this?

I have today ordered the JHM spacers + bypass kit, along with all injector seals etc.

Looking forward to assembly the car again!! :slight_smile:

#32

Brake cleaner is a good way to clean everything. Then a little bit of WD40 just to make sure you don’t dry it out. Also once you have cleaned it. It’s not a bad idea to water or pressure test all of the PCV hoses. All of the plastic hoses are good to test. They can get small cracks in them

The JHM spacers and bypass is almost a must for these cars. They really help in so many different ways.

Get the car back together and then feel free to start your own thread and let others know all you saw and ran into.

#33

I don’t have access to a VAGcom here so it will have to wait until I relocate (don’t even have a working PC, only macs).

But I just did the same test drive loop without ever crossing the 4500 RPM changeover limit with the IM and everything was perfect. I even got 19.2MPG in moderately heavy highway traffic. This leads me to believe the misfires have something to do with my installation of the “long runner” flashing––maybe some foreign particles still passing through; an leaky epoxy seal somewhere; or the ECU adapting to the long runners(?).

Fingers crossed, I’ll take this car on a 6-hr road trip next week in covid/chill mode…

#34

Good morning, afternoon or evening (depending on where each one of you is located),

Just joined the forum as I am (hopefully) soon to be owner of a S8 D3 from 2007, so basically the same engine as the S6.
I have known for quite some time that the IM was an issue on these cars but I have always thought that removing the flap was the only option beside replacing them.
So now, I am very interested in this mod/fix. Being located in France, <4.500RPM would be 95% of my driving (I am not an engine pusher, I own a Ducati for that :smiley: ), improving idling and mpg would be optimal.
So here are my questions :
_ if the flaps are not broken, do you still remove them or do you just lock them in place ? If so, how ? (what kind of epoxy temperature wise and where do you apply it ?)
_ if removing the flaps, how did you get the aluminium sheet to stick ?

Thanks in advance for the knowledge.

Cheers mates and happy new year !

#35

Here’s what I did:

It seems to work. The AL sheet metal is wedged in pretty tight, so it’s not going anywhere. But I can’t guarantee that the fit is perfect and the seals to the long runners are air tight. Still, it should be a lot better than having nothing in there at all.

I do notice that the MPG has slightly improved. And the engine pulls nicely once warm. But I’m still troubleshooting some rough idle issues on cold start––P0023 code, not sure it’s related to the IM flap hack.

#36

Hi Mixofia,

Thank you for answering. So you just pushed/pressed it in there ? No epoxy, nothing ?
Do you feel any difference past 4.000/4.500 rpm anyway ? (because you no longer have short runners available)

#37

Justin.

We’ve had a small discussion regarding the stability in idle with the flaps removed.
As you know I disagree, would a video on my idle make you think different? Could video my RPMs via VCDS - I also did a coin test at one point :sweat_smile:.

Maybe bad idle with flaps removed is due to something different?

#38

Hi everybody,

I see that opinions may diverge on the subject. First thing to clarify, are we talking about the internal flaps (the plastic ones). Please do aknowledge that it is also advised to lock the external ones in the open position (from what I know at least).
@mixofia, @Kimovitzh, I think that US V10s and EUR have a slight difference in the mappings. That might be something.
In my experience, gutting the intake as never created any issue idling. You do loose torque, but barely noticeable on such a big engine.
The best is obviously to have the plastic flaps working…

#39

There is a difference in the mapping. I’ve asked about this with my long list of questions to the v10 support mail at JHM (the guy on the other end has been very patient with me, (sorry!) ).

As my intake was broken to begin with I didn’t know what I lost, but I definitely feel a big gain in pull from around 3500-4000 rpm that just keeps on increasing all the way to 7000 rpm.

It only stops due to rev limiter.

#40

Hi max welcome to the site.

Lets place some facts in this conversation that should help with direction.

The US and Euro tunes intake wise are the same. Meaning from a logging perspective the short flaps only seem to be activated after 4500rpm (or there about depending on load) This is shown in both logging and the Audi study guide.

Plain and simple…

Gutting the intake is a disaster. Sure there will always be people with a lower standard of what they are willing to accept as a good running car but in 32 different situations of individuals on this site that have tested and reported their results on and after broken intake manifolds and gutted them Vs the 20 or so that have just epoxied the short runner have all without fail said the same thing.

AND that is… The car is less prone to misfire with the flaps in. There is more TQ (obviously) 40TQ and 35whp as measured by two separate people on a dyno before and after with a working intake Vs a non working intake. You will see a better MPG with the flaps in and overall a better driving running car around town. The car is more responsive and runs smoother… Keep in mind the smoother part is going to be more relative to each individual.

Factually speaking you’re obviously better off having the flaps in the long runner position due to how the car is set up originally and so are all of the other multi stage intake cars. Meaning long runner flap position for driving under 4500rpm.

The choice is clear. If you plan on doing most of your driving around and or under 4500rpm. Then you would be best served having the intake in the long runner position. This is how Audi set it up and everything from performance to dyno results show there is a clear advantage.

Now with that being said. Can you gut your intake and still have a good running car… Absolutely…It’s not like the car is undriveable or even un enjoyable with the flaps removed. Will the car idle… obviously will the car drive… yes…will it work yes…With it be as good as a fully functional intake… Obsoletely not. Will it be as good as a intake with the flaps shut under 4500rpm… Absolutely not… even common sense alone would dictate that.

As stated before. This issue has been looked at over and over. Without fail the options from over 50 collective individuals (and you can search on this site) all have the same conclusion

If you can get a working intake that is best.
If you have to lock the runners. Lock them in the long runner for best everyday
Try to save the runners if possible. If you can’t save the runners block off the short path.
If you can’t do any of the above. You’re best off gutting the intake.