Trayvon Martin shooting

[bangoman]

[quote]Instead one ended up dying because the other had a handgun at his disposal and as usual a fight escalated into a murder in an instant.
[/quote]
That’s pretty much it right there. Very sad.

[tweetss4estate]

I couldn’t agree more.

[Snow_Trooper]

Nice summary. The US media is a pile of crap.

[Apat]

Zimmerman was a stick of dynamite and Martin was the match that lit it. IMO both individuals were destined to get into some sort of confrontation with another person or group of individuals eventually. Its just too bad someone died before they both were able to learn their lessons and grow as individuals.

[sakimano]

… riots in 3…2…1…

[ChrisK]

No one was innsocent in this. why people riot just show the class of people making the argument look worse.

[notarmed]

Is it just me, or is this fucking story annoying?

First off, it sucks the kid died. Too many fucking handguns in America mean conflicts are too often resolved with a lethal weapon. That’s another argument thoug.

However why the fuck is this kid always shown in his grade 5 football team photo or wearing a hollister sweater when he was 12? The kid, by the time he was shot, was rocking gold teeth, had tattoos, flashed gang signs and named himself ‘no limit nigga’ (WTF!) on his twitter account. Clearly a confused kid looking for his identity. Sounds like he lived in a nice neighbourhood…but wanted to portray himself as a gangster instead. The media on the other hand wants this to be black vs. white etc. I think that’s fucking dumb. It should be facts first…fuck the racism angle. Fact is, two people came together and one got shot. Let’s look at the facts please…not the hype.

Everyone gets riled up at the perceived racist murder of this angellic little boy when they look at the photo of Trayvon wearing hollister…and they look at a weird driver’s license photo of George Zimmerman wearing an orange golf shirt (that they crop so it looks like a booking photo where he’s in jail).

https://encrypted-tbn2.google.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRNdTbrTKziLyQyDX0JcBxWxyEogeoRGQC3Lz2pYgJodJ2lLCPSKg

That’s to make you NOT look at the facts and rush to judgement. Well, here’s another pair of images to help you NOT look at the facts and make a judgement. This is Trayvon’s twitter profile pic. Here’s his twitpics link
http://twitpic.com/photos/NO_LIMIT_NIGGA

https://encrypted-tbn2.google.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQG4KUVk-y-ZKEPuM3npZRxDd0r0Hib7KdSAUGPHBSECFiIm3In

https://encrypted-tbn0.google.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSaVr5Om52hHvejMJgkhmAKYxNM6GWASRZ1DN2iuMy8ut1y3oNuBg

Now that the bullshit photos are out of the way, from what I can tell here are some of the key facts:

-Zimmerman is a psycho wannabe cop who put himself in a situation he didn’t need to put himself into

-he caused a phone call to escalate into a confrontation by pursuing a ‘suspect’ (lol he’s mental) after he was effectively told not to by 911 (they said ‘we don’t need you to do that’ when they asked if he was folllowing. Perhaps if they’d said DO NOT FOLLOW HIM this would never happen?)

That’s where his ‘wrongness’ ends based on the evidence we have (yes, I’ve read most of the disclosure). Maybe he’s a racist. Maybe he’s a psycho. Great…let’s hear about it in court. Until then, let’s stick to the facts.

-After that, he and Trayvon got into a fight, Trayvon got Zimmerman on the ground, achieved ‘full mount’ (a witness said ‘the black male in the hoodie was beating on the white male MMA style’)

-A 911 caller whose house they were behind was close enough to clearly hear the screams of ‘HELP’ and HELP ME PLEASE’ coming from the struggle (14 times the word HELP was screamed)

-When that tape was played for Trayvon Martin’s father a few days later at the police station with 2 police officers present (they were explaining why they hadn’t arrested Zimmerman) Mr. Martin was asked “in your opinion was the voice calling for help 14 times that of your son?” to which he replied “No.”

-After the case received national attention weeks later, and Travon was portrayed as a sad hero/victim, his father would later change his story 180 degrees on CNN’s Anderson Cooper (and just about every other tv talk show that would have him) saying it was sad to hear his son’s last words, being cries for help. He was asked point blank by Anderson Cooper ‘You have no doubt that was Trayvon crying for help’ and Martin stumbled…stuttered…paused…then stammered out ‘I’m…I’m…I’m sure that’s his voice’

-Trayvon was unharmed other than the bullet wound, and contusions and lacerations to his knuckles, injuries consistent with having just laid a beat down on someone per the witnesses descriptions

-Zimmerman had a badly broken nose, a laceration on his lip, two lacerations on the back of his head, no wounds to his hands, two black eyes

To me it looks like as I said above, Zimmerman was a wannabe cop, and Travyon was a wannabe tough guy gangsta. A recipe for fucking disaster. Both acted like idiots. If he didn’t have that gun, Zimmerman would have got his ass fucking beat (deservedly I might add), Trayvon would have been pulled off by a neighbour eventually, and it would have been a he-said, she-said fist fight that the cops would have washed away once they realised Trayvon was a kid with family in teh area. Zimmerman would have had some serious wounds to lick and a load of embarrassment, and the cops would have said ‘hey…you’re a fucking moron. Stop pretending you’re a cop’

Instead one ended up dying because the other had a handgun at his disposal and as usual a fight escalated into a murder in an instant.

What do you think?

Trayvon supposedly told Zimmerman: “You’re gonna die tonight” or some other version. That is why he felt threatened enough to shoot.

If Chappell had the racial draft, I don’t think the whites nor the Hispanics would take Zimmerman.

[sakimano]

That sounds like someone building a defence to me. I doubt the kid said that.

[soaRS4]

Ultimately, if guns were not present, I doubt this event would have occurred. You think Zimmerman would have confronted an unknown thread directly (even with his so-called MMA training)? As matter of fact, his MMA training should have given him the wisdom to walk, since results can be subjective - a win is not guaranteed. Unless there’s no way out, it’s safer to avoid and live to fight another day.

But it’s typical; guns give a false sense of strength that quickly escalates the situation beyond any chance of de-escalation - once the gun is drawn, the lethality of the situation is almost a forgone conclusion. In contrast, in countries where guns are illegal, conflicts usually involve fists and sure, there are going to be some bloody noses or broken bones, but very rarely are there any deaths. Even knives are not as lethal.

Get rid of the guns, let the cops do their job and more people will live to see another day…

[sakimano]

One in 10,000 fistfights results in getting beaten to death

One in 100 stabbings results in death

One in 10 shootings results in death.

It’s a highly effective and dangerous escalation tool.

[euroswagr]

In contrast, in countries where guns are illegal, conflicts usually involve fists and sure, there are going to be some bloody noses or broken bones, but very rarely are there any deaths. Even knives are not as lethal.

Get rid of the guns, let the cops do their job and more people will live to see another day…

Not even close dude… and taking guns out of the peoples hands who respect and follow the laws will do nothing to those who could care less about law.

If you don’t want to own a gun, then don’t…if you want to live another day, then don’t argue with people or be confrontational…if someone breaks into your house at night, then give him everything, all of your cash, anything he wants and hope he doesn’t rape your wife and make you watch or kill you…because in the end he obviously didn’t give a shit about the first law he broke by breaking and entering so what is stopping him from escalating.

Since the beginning of time there have been people who have no decency, changing laws will never rid any society of these people. If they don’t do it with a gun it will be something else…owning a gun is a responsibility that many can’t handle, but some people also shouldn’t reproduce or have pets…but they do… so where will we stop these limitations?

Let cops do their job…lol

[quote]guns give a false sense of strength
[/quote]
most cops can’t handle the authority they are given.

[bigserve134]

In contrast, in countries where guns are illegal, conflicts usually involve fists and sure, there are going to be some bloody noses or broken bones, but very rarely are there any deaths. Even knives are not as lethal.

Get rid of the guns, let the cops do their job and more people will live to see another day…

Not even close dude… and taking guns out of the peoples hands who respect and follow the laws will do nothing to those who could care less about law.

If you don’t want to own a gun, then don’t…if you want to live another day, then don’t argue with people or be confrontational…if someone breaks into your house at night, then give him everything, all of your cash, anything he wants and hope he doesn’t rape your wife and make you watch or kill you…because in the end he obviously didn’t give a shit about the first law he broke by breaking and entering so what is stopping him from escalating.

[b]Since the beginning of time there have been people who have no decency, changing laws will never rid any society of these people. If they don’t do it with a gun it will be something else…owning a gun is a responsibility that many can’t handle, but some people also shouldn’t reproduce or have pets…but they do… so where will we stop these limitations?

Let cops do their job…lol

[quote]guns give a false sense of strength

most cops can’t handle the authority they are given.
[/quote]
[/b]

Amen.

[Datadatum]

Not proud of my country.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/0d/World_map_of_civilian_gun_ownership_-2nd_color_scheme.svg/800px-World_map_of_civilian_gun_ownership-_2nd_color_scheme.svg.png

[Jupiteraudi]

In contrast, in countries where guns are illegal, conflicts usually involve fists and sure, there are going to be some bloody noses or broken bones, but very rarely are there any deaths. Even knives are not as lethal.

Get rid of the guns, let the cops do their job and more people will live to see another day…

Not even close dude… and taking guns out of the peoples hands who respect and follow the laws will do nothing to those who could care less about law.

If you don’t want to own a gun, then don’t…if you want to live another day, then don’t argue with people or be confrontational…if someone breaks into your house at night, then give him everything, all of your cash, anything he wants and hope he doesn’t rape your wife and make you watch or kill you…because in the end he obviously didn’t give a shit about the first law he broke by breaking and entering so what is stopping him from escalating.

Since the beginning of time there have been people who have no decency, changing laws will never rid any society of these people. If they don’t do it with a gun it will be something else…owning a gun is a responsibility that many can’t handle, but some people also shouldn’t reproduce or have pets…but they do… so where will we stop these limitations?

Let cops do their job…lol

[quote]guns give a false sense of strength

most cops can’t handle the authority they are given.
[/quote]
Well said Euro.

[ChrisK]

Here is what I think is getting missed. Travon was on drugs at the time of this…he was kicked oiut of school for fighting and bringing drugs into school…if this was travon shooting Zimmerman we wouldn’t even be talking about this…the media thinks were so stupid that posting pictures of travon at 12 vs thr pictures of the gold tooth drug addact that he was…

[soaRS4]

…taking guns out of the peoples hands who respect and follow the laws will do nothing to those who could care less about law.

…most cops can’t handle the authority they are given.

Many, many deaths are either a consequence of some yahoo, lowlife who thinks he’s king shit with a gun, and causes deaths that could have been prevented if they weren’t abusing alcohol or drugs or had better education.
Other deaths are due to innocents killing other innocents (improperly stored guns handled by children, etc).
And sure, others deaths are happening by true psychopaths and evil people - nothing will change that.

But if I were American, I would happily give up my gun and risk coming across an armed desperato robbing me of my cash, with removing the millions of guns on the loose causing so many deaths.

I live in Canada where where guns are strictly controlled by law. I have never personally known anyone who’s be robbed at gunpoint or anyone even injured by one. I feel no need to own a gun or to use one. I am highly trained in martial arts (Kyukoshin karate) so if I had to, I could fight my way out. I have never had to use karate even once in my life.

I am also happy the cops are there and can handle situations with weapons, for many reasons:

• the cops won’t have to deal with armed citizens getting into a shootout with the real criminals. A cop stumbling onto a gun fight has no idea who the killer is and the innocent citizen. It complicates the situation more than it needs to;
• not every citizen with a gun is trained, whereas every cop is required to be trained on it’s use and when to use it. I would be seriously concerned if someone pulled a gun in public and 20 citizens pull theirs and bullets start to fly;
• I have many police friends who are highly trained and very effective with their weapons - especially those with SWAT, so I am not sure where you obtained your information on police tactics and training. I would trust them with weapons more than any civilian I know (other than military).
• if ever someone does break into my house to attack rather than rob, he is in for a big surprise regarding my abilities to defend. He may think he has an unarmed person under his control, but when push comes to shove, and I don’t have any choice but to defend myself and my family, believe me, I am capable and trained to kill quickly and don’t need a gun to do it. Btw, most of the uncontrolled, illegal guns we see here in Canada come from the states.

Since the beginning of time there have been people who have no decency, changing laws will never rid any society of these people. If they don’t do it with a gun it will be something else…owning a gun is a responsibility that many can’t handle, but some people also shouldn’t reproduce or have pets…but they do… so where will we stop these limitations?

I would still prefer guns be restricted and I deal with some shithead with has only a knife or fists. My chances of surviving are much greater than if we both have guns. Even if I have a gun and he doesn’t, it is possible the situation could flip and my gun be used against me. Without guns, this would not be possible and my opponent would face my hands an feet - it would be a quick fight.

But I also understand the right to bare arms is enshrined in the constitution and so I am not going to argue that point - majority (or should I say money) rules and I’m not American so my opinion counts for squat. I just find it a shame so many people die needlessly.

[sakimano]

the other facts about trayvon and zimmerman that get missed include

1. he was trespassing. He hopped a fence to get into this neighbourhood in the first place. It’s a private neighbourhood.

2. the neighbourhood had been suffering a rash of break ins of late, putting the community on edge (and nerdsauce zimmerman)

Nobody talks about that for some reason.

Also interesting was that Trayvon was a white hating racist, ironically. A quick review of his now deleted twitter page shows it is RIDDLED with anti-white posts and language. Further, his manatee of a girlfriend confirmed Trayvon’s description of Zimmerman as a ‘CREEPY ASS CRACKA’. Again…nobody mentioned that. Nobody wants to talk about wannabe gangsta Trayvon (from a nice middleclass family) being a confirmed racist and perhaps taking on Zimmerman. Clearly Zimmerman was following him, but you know he was just being a rat waiting for the cops to come. THe fact it got physical wasn’t zimmerman’s plan. Maybe racist Trayvon created a situation with a guy who was unforunately carrying

Knowing Trayvon used a racist term to describe Zimmerman, can you imagine the outrage if Zimmerman had used a racist term to describe Trayvon?

Pretty lame ass story all around.

My theory - America is FUCKED with guns, so you can’t ban them now, because it’s too much a part of American culture and crime. Registries to make getting guns tougher and stuff can help a bit, but a ban will never work. They’re just too hooked on the crazy (fucking moronic) notion that more guns in America willl equal more safety. It won’t. The country is just too stupid. No offense to some of the Americans on the site. However the grand majority of your country is literally too stupid to own a gun…yet they’re quite likely to own 2-3.

Switzerland is rampant with guns. Not much gun killing there. Mostly long guns from mandatory military service. Canada too…and we have our share of gun crime…but nothing like the US.

[euroswagr]

My point is people are stupid, guns aren’t the issue…and there is no such thing as racism against whites…which Zimmerman was about as white as Obama.

I don’t think the majority of America thinks that more guns= more safety and for the amount of people that do own guns in America our rates are still some of the lowest in the world

I am with you on the idiots that own guns, but I also think people should have to take a test and be found fit to reproduce…none of those things should be controlled by a higher entity though especially our POS Federal government.

[justincredible]

I have a carry weapon permit and I carry. when guns were banned in Australia gun crime went up 800% the same has happened in other countrys. I don’t have a gun for any other reason then it didn’t take a gun for those people on drugs to eat peoples face or for the people to bomb the Boston marathon or for the large percentage of other people that wer killed 38+% of murders are done without guns. Detroit is the second largest crime city in America only second to another city in Michigan. death crimes are about 45% non guns in Detroit. Its dangerous people have lots there minds.

In some countrys guns are not needed in others they are. All depends on the mental state of the people in the country. this is very true
Many, many deaths are either a consequence of some yahoo, lowlife who thinks he’s king shit with a gun or a bat or a knif, and causes deaths that could have been prevented if they weren’t abusing alcohol or drugs or had better education.

Making guns non existent for honest people just puts the dishonest people at an advantage. The USA is basically a cesspool of crime and low moral standards. Gangs drugs trafficking and violent crime is illegal here but we have no shortage of any of it. The same people that are in gangs drugs trafficking and violent crime don’t care about the law just like they don’t care about gun laws. Its people like me who are not into any of that and don’t even where to get involved in any of that. that are effected by gun laws.

A good friend of mine said I never met a criminal that cared about gun laws. You don’t meet a gang banger getting ready to do a drive by that just came from registering his gun. MAkeing guns illegal is just make it like crack. only criminals into illegal wrong can get it. PEople in america think twice about pulling crime in Texas where you know everyone has a gun.

As for trayvon its just the media trying to do more racist storys that keep America from coming together. The biggest crime in America is the media

[Axel]

when guns were banned in Australia gun crime went up 800% the same has happened in other countrys.

Please provide a source for this statement. Everything I’ve read has shown gun crime going down in Australia post ban (and please show it for these other countries as well).

I’ve also read made up numbers from the NRA but even they didn’t go as far as saying 800%.