They’re not dramatically different. 8 percent or so.
Delta is all that matters on a dyno anyway, and the absolute numbers are entirely irrelevant vs other dynos.
Something else interesting about that dyno at 034…these results gather over the past 2 weeks on the 034 mustang dyno.
BenST-Lie - 325 WHP
APR tune
EBwerks catless 2.75" downpipes+EBwerks catback exhaust
meem - 327 WHP
APR tune
AWE catback exhaust (stock downpipes and cats)
So, EBwerks 2.75" catless downpipes and 2.75" catback exhaust vs stock diameter AWE catback…and the ebwerks fullback added a loss of 2 WHP??
Funny, Ben hasn’t addressed that little discrepancy lol.
[quote=meem on quattroworld]speaking of videos – and proof that i will get my rs4 dirty for a good cause: i had it baselined on 034’s mustang dyno this wet morning.
it fared better than i expected (327 whp) and we probably should’ve let it adapt more, as it got stronger with each of the three runs (just apr chip and awe exhaust).
as a datapoint, an rs4 with jhm’s supercharger recorded 390whp on that dyno last month.
it will be interesting to see the tvs1740 supercharger numbers soon 
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The other tidbit that keeps popping up is that a JHM supercharger kit dyno’d at “only 390whp” but what no one seems to understand is that a.) it is a stage 1 kit and b.) the whole point of stage 1 is to get ready for stage 2. So, yeah sure it will be interesting to see the APR kit’s numbers on that dyno but even more so the JHM stage 2 kit’s numbers. Then we will be comparing apples to apples and still at a substantial cost and more importantly in mind boost difference.
yeah, I was surprised by that…do they really not realise that JHM has 2 stages for their supercharger kit?
Can’t be…can it? These people are so into JHM and following every move they (and their customers) make…you’d think they’d know the product lineup lol.
I’d say that’s reasonable. Run to run will have variances, especially if we’re talking in the neighborhood of only 2 AWHP and only two data points, that being the peak power figure and not an entire dyno curve. On these big V8 engines, even differences in oil temp will play into a few HP here and there. Id look at the whole curve. It will be far more beneficial.
We tend to see a full catless exhaust produce pretty significant peak delta over one with stock downpipes and just a catback.
Arin, any thoughts on why BenST-Lie’s car dyno’d 3 WHP less when they added the APR tune? 034 said ‘it needs to adapt’ but I thought I remembered you saying on here somewhere that adaptation talk is a bit over-rated and the cars adapt right away. Maybe that was on the B8 not the B7.
[quote=“sakimano,post:36,topic:5220”]
I’ve seen gains in low end torque. Top end and peak power, not so much.
It should be easy to point out if the vehicle was logged.
really? how about this example
stock everything 327 whp
add jhm tune/full exhaust 365 whp
same fuel, same conditions
+38 peak whp
I guesss you’re saying that gain of peak whp is just from the JHM tune? And if we were to take the JHM exhaust off his car, and put the stock exhaust with all cats in the downpipes back on, he would lose a little of the fatness in the curve, but make the same peak WHP?
Where’s the stock run?
Also, you shouldn’t use STD correction. Even Dynojet states this. It’s an old standard that will always produce higher results.
That doesn’t make any sense or follow any of the dynos that others have done.
This is just one more example of why dyno sheet racing is useless.
I think we can all agree on this. Ben lost hp after getting APR tuned…what does that say…do any of us believe that a APR tune will loose hp for you…no…the same thing that happened to bens car effecting it to loose hp could very well be the same thing from keeping a stage 1 car from making even more power…if you have a car loose power after getting tuned and a car that has a kit that produces good numbers at the track both suffer…to me that says there is something inadaquit about something on the dyno to help cool these cars down or to provide a real environment for truthful power.
Well the JHM supercharged car has already proven itself on the track. To bash the dyno numbers is foolish. My guess is the area under the curve is very broad compared to another car that will dyno, say 500 where the curve simply hits a peak with less total area under the curve. Let’s not forget what the JHM s4 stage 1 dyno’ed versus NGNG’s car…and look who came out on top…
Do we have copies of the both dyno charts? You might see the differences there. Peak is a pointless number that means nothing on the street. Just bragging rights.
Of course everyone on AR knows that, so where are the damn graphs?
It’s here somewhere. Does it matter? I can find it if you need it. Anyway your point was that peak isn’t influenced by the exhaust.
Nobody is talking about that. You’re way off topic from this already off topic tangent
Arins point is that the exhaust helps the curve but not peak hp numbers. If an rs4 makes 365 whp and 311 wtq when modified with tune and full exhaust…but it makes 327 and 2something (mistro what was it exactly?) when stock, I really wouldn’t think you can say that without the exhaust the car would still make 365 whp. Or anywhere within 15 whp of that. I could be wrong.
Exactly. We need jhm to share some of the stage 1 stuff. They are working on a launch video so I’m sure we will see it soon enough.
Here’s the thread about it. The dyno does read a bit high apparently, but I think the point here would be the delta’s and curve’s of course.
http://audirevolution.net/forum/index.php?topic=1902.0
Initial was just run wasn’t “stock” in the strict sense. I had an ecs h-pipe (same diameter as stock, no resonators, h crossover). Bit of a moot point, but might as well lay it all out. All other variables are outlined in the thread.
This picture is attached to a for sale ad for ebwerks exhaust. It is Denis’ car, the one that is now JHM supercharged. Here’s his dyno when he was stock.
Not exactly lighting the world on fire there…doesn’t really look like a healthy car up top. Maybe it reeeeeally needed a carbon clean.
STOCK: 265 WHP, 235 WTQ
EBWERKS FULL EXHAUST: 280 WHP, 275 WTQ
that makes the delta between his pre-SC dyno and post SC dyno 110 WHP. Doesn’t look like the same dyno though. SuperFlow WynDyn. Not sure I’ve ever heard of that.
In any event, it’s another B7 RS4 gaining a healthy amount of peak WHP from an exhaust modification. I’m definitely not sold on Arin’s theory.
I still find it weird that Arin said that. Like I said it goes against anything we have seen on a 4.2. Maybe he was thinking of B8. His claim try’s to somewhat add to BenStlies fucked up dyno comparisons.
Anyways fuck this dyno racing, if Ben really thinks his car or other bolt-on cars are close to the stage one kit because of this dyno day then it shouldn’t be hard to find a car with a kit in Cali and prove something.
Sakimono,
First, the “EBWerks” exhaust Ben’ has is the prototype that has the Sebring mufflers that JHM sells with their exhaust, not the custom made mufflers we have made for our exhaust. That said, the ONLY thing the exhaust Ben has that shares anything to the production exhaust is the X pipe merge- 2.75" piping. That is it.
That said, It could be that Ben is not running the 2.75" exhaust after he crashed his car yet again on the hill side. From what i’m told he had underside damage sooo who knows.
Yes those Dynographs are from a Dennis car, are from a Dyno i paid to get done a before and after. Same Dyno, only difference was exhaust- and he had a bad sensor that was causing his car to run rich. I don’t recall which sensor. His car had approx ~60k miles- no carbon clean.
Like you said on your previous post, the delta is the key. It made power