The carbon fiber wheels on the 350R are made by Carbon Revolution. They are listed on TiKORE’s website. TiKORE is the sponsor on AZ that sells ti lug bolts. The wheels are listed for $15.8K.
http://www.tikore.com/single-piece-carbon-fiber-wheel-cr9-set/
I find it interesting that they don’t give an actual weight for the wheels. At $15.8K the wheels better weigh less than ten pounds each for 19 inch diameter.
They weigh 15lbs Jimmy. I inquired about these wheels last year and they told me they couldn’t even sell them to me with their standard warranty lol.
That is stupidly expensive for a wheel that still weighs a lot. Then to not even offer a warranty, wow.
From a Nissan GT-R forum:
[quote]There are several different methods of construction for “carbon” brakes. Each one has its own merits.
The three main types are:
CFRC (carbon fiber reinforced ceramic) - which is what AP Racing/Stillen, Alcon and Mov’It brakes use [Stillen calls it CCM-X); the process is pioneered by the British company Surface Transforms [ST] who is the manufacturer for the discs that AP, Alcon and Mov’It use. The carbon is laid in continuous pieces and then the ceramic material is added to strengthen the structure. CFRC is superior because it is extremely durable and doesn’t oxidize as quickly as other forms. CFRC is lifetime of the car if kept properly cool, but it’s the most expensive production process.
CCM (ceramic composite material) - is what the SpecV, ZR1, LFA and Ferrari rotors utilize. It’s the more ubiquitous carbon construction type, utilizing a ceramic core with chopped carbon fibers in a matrix of ceramic and resin that’s heat cured. It’s generally the cheapest construction method, but it’s not as durable or effective as CFRC.
CCB (carbon ceramic brakes) - this is what Audi, Porsche, Bentley and Lambo use. It’s a core of ceramic material reinforced with carbon fiber and covered by another layer of ceramic material (better for street use).
Then there’s the carbon-carbon construction that you mentioned, which is straight up carbon. Carbon-Carbon is real race car stuff [F1], utilizing super lightweight carbon discs and full carbon pads. Carbon-Carbon needs heat to operate properly (warming up), but also needs proper cooling to keep from overheating.
There are carbon-carbon options for the R35, but no one is really utilizing them (Jotech does have a customer car with them right now though).
What Brembo is doing now with these CCM-R products seems like it’s their own kind of variation of the CFRC construction, so thus the higher price tag versus the “dime a dozen” ZR1 CCM rotors.
[/quote]
Looks like they clear non-bent 19x8.5 peelers. :
They didn’t clear my bent peelers (bend confirmed by tire shop) with 8mm spacers putting them at ET35.
Brembo GT 380s with OEM Peelers
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-9mFRE_7WH7s/Tp4XSE_K1LI/AAAAAAAAAF0/9DVOLpRdkMY/s800/D7K_1843.JPG
Another quote on why these are worth $14k:
https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3876/14654786885_47481cfb3e_o.jpg
I don’t know West, I think this kind of money would be better spent on more of your creative weight reduction. Carbon fiber roof, hood, front fenders, and trunk perhaps? Maybe carbon fiber door cards? Reduced weight would help with brake performance also. Just a thought.
I’m pretty sold on the idea of a ceramic disc. Turns out the ones on new cars aren’t even as good as this. The benefit on the nose heavy Audi is I only have to do the fronts. This is like a $40k job on a 991.
It’s sort of a question of what technology is in supercars and track ready street cars in 2015. You can pony up and buy a $100k car, or try out some of this technology on a chassis like the S4.
Interesting way to look at it. What pads do you use with these and how long do they last?
Pagid RSC1, RSC2 or RSC3 (3 is endurance). I imagine they’d last over 1 year. These pads are not available for Audi ceramics and have spotty availability on Porsche, Ferrari.
The 750 degree post cool down temps I see on the paddock with steel rotors would likely drop below 450 degrees.
I’m going to ask the impossible question here: anyone tried a street pad on the track that they actually like?
I’m using PFC 1038 (AKA TRD pads) and they are ok. They will survive a handful of hot laps but then they fade and the bite drops so much that your braking zones are extended big time. Of course, that’s to be expected on a street pad. But mind you, this is on a 355mm bbk already with no backing plates. Some brake ducting will help.
Curious to know anyone’s experience with the new fangled stuff. HPS 5.0 or something similar?
I tried the stoptech street perf pads (albiet only on the street). Really didn’t like those. No bite.
On the Boxster I used Portersfield R4-S pads to get some more initial bite on the street. Haven’t tracked them but they also sell a model with a name like R4 that is track-only. I like them.
I’ll look into R4s/R4. Thanks for the tip!
I used pagid RS29 before and LOVE those. But uh yeah. Noisy is an understatement.
http://daniwao.files.wordpress.com/2010/02/unicorn.jpg?w=406&h=304
If you were in the green/blue run group, then maybe, but you’re driving the car hard as hell. Imagine if you were running r-comps :o Just bite the bullet and run some track pads ;D My .02
I’ve been down that road and it ended poorly, I would highly suggest just getting the track pads and doing swaps.
sigh. you guys suck j/k 
I wanted to stay away from track pads and swapping etc etc. The more work that goes into this car, the less practical it becomes. the reason why i went with the s4 in the first place (which by the way, i complain about all the time XD) is because it’s a practical car that can do everything some what well.
If i went seats/real suspension/real brakes then honestly, there are much better cars than the S4 out there for that purpose. That’s why i stubbornly stick with my whole street tire thing, and street pads. Honestly, PFC1038 is surprisingly good…that track I was just at is horrible for brakes, and they were the best street pad I’ve tried. On anything longer with more cooling, they’d be solid. Though I can always do with better…if there is such a thing for a street pad
FWIW hawk turned their DTC30 race pad into a street friendly, quiet pad through the inclusion of shims and a different backing plate. Unfortunately, no pad shape for ST60s yet, but those would be my go-to choice otherwise. I read good and bad things about EBC blue’s, but per the description, it’d suit my usecase. Just wondering if anyone had tried anything like these sorts of intermediate pads.
Update on the CCM-R project: my brakes guy at Frozen Rotors in Minnesota is conferring with Brembo about my kit. The plan would be for me to keep my Brembo GT-R calipers, swap the mounting hardware for the ceramic offset, and purchase 2 CCM-R discs for $6900 each. Then a set of Pagid RSC3 pads for $800.
At first Brembo suggested I just ditch the calipers until they realized it was a GT-R, not a GT. Then they got bent out of shape that I was only doing the fronts until they realized it was a B8 with the sliding caliper rear. I’m glad I have an intermediary to work these things out for me.
I have no idea if I’ll actually pull the trigger on this. I probably wouldn’t make that call until March 2016. I normally do 7 track days January-May. That second season would be enough to wear through the steel Brembo rotors.
EDIT: my quoted price is $12,265 all in.
I really don’t know the physics of brake pad compounds. But my experience leads me to believe in order for temperature stability way up there (2000 deg or whatever these race pads go to) you need a pad that is noisy and dusts. Not to mention the pad that works near 2000 deg will not work while putting around town. Plus race pads are abrasive on rotors at low temps.
I need to take 2hr the wed before/after an event to change tires + pads. Would be much quicker if I didn’t swap rear pads (since that requires vcds, which requires trickle charger etc.). Guess I’m willing to sacrifice that time (and added initial cost of second setup) to know my brakes will work on track (I’m not skilled at knowing when to back off, as evidenced by my “off” lol) and have nice clean street wheels without any obnoxious noise (even in the cold the 1521’s perform like champs).
It’s all relative IMO. I can take a bunch of people out to lunch on Friday and they would have no idea my car is an animal on track. Likewise, the guys on track with full out track cars who I’m hanging with would probably be impressed this car also functions as a grocery getter. I just have to sacrifice the 4 hr of wrenching per event (which sometimes I enjoy lol ;D).
Man, after you’ve swapped them for a few years, it becomes second nature. I can get mine done with a floor jack in a little less than an hour now haha. I swap my pads out at the paddock after I go through tech inspection. I usually am the second session out and my brakes are done by then.
Technical info on CSiC rotors http://www.surfacetransforms.com/files/smmt_surface_transforms_article_march_2014.pdf
[quote]Manufacturer – Surface Transforms plc, UK
Surface Transforms plc (ST) is the UK’s leading manufacturer of ‘next-generation’ carbon fiber reinforced ceramic composite materials (CFRCs).
Carbon ceramics, or to give the full name, Carbon Fiber Reinforced Ceramics, are carbon composite materials which combine the stiffness and strength of carbon fiber in a carbon matrix, with the high temperature resistant properties of ceramics such as silicon carbide, which replace part of the carbon matrix material.
ST’s high-performance products are being commercialized with major industry partners for an expanding range of innovative global applications – using cutting-edge technology developed by the company.
Customer Applications
Surface Transforms’ SystemST carbon ceramic brakes are fitted to the Koenigsegg CCX, CCGT, Agera R, Ascari A10, and Callaway C16.
Features
Continuous fibers
3% elongation of fiber pre-cursors
High thermal conductivity/heat transfer
Homogeneous material structure
Solid ceramic component
High thermal and mechanical strength
Repairable
Improved cooling with greater surface-volume ratio
Lower operating temperature
Improved fade resistance
SystemST – Carbon Fiber Reinforced Ceramic Brakes
SystemST is the newest product in ceramic road car brakes, but ST is actually one of the oldest companies in ceramic brakes for other high-tech applications. During the last twenty years ST has been active in the aerospace, high speed rail, and motorsport markets. By combining cutting-edge aerospace technology with Formula 1 know-how tested to the highest specifications, this new product delivers the ultimate in high-performance brakes. ST’s ceramic brakes are designed to replace traditional carbon-carbon brake rotors used on aircraft and the cast iron brake rotors used on automotive applications.
Applications
Automotive brakes
Motorsport brakes
Aircraft brakes
Rail brakes
It is useful to understand the origins of the CFRC material to appreciate its capability. CFRC friction material for brake rotors was developed for (and paid for by) the European high speed rail industry, the heavy aircraft (airliner) industry, and the British Government through research grants. Bullet trains weigh hundreds of tons and have to stop from 300 km/hr. Airliners weigh up to 400,000 pounds and have to stop from 150 knots in 10,000 feet, on a limited number of tires/brakes. And every pound is precious on a commercial aircraft because the carrier has to pay for the fuel that carries that weight for millions of miles in an aircraft’s lifetime. Given those constraints, developing and producing this technology was cost-effective for those industries. The automotive market is a secondary beneficiary of all that R&D investment, without additional cost.
Manufacturing Technology – CFRCs & CSiC
ST has developed a proprietary process to convert carbon-carbon materials into Carbon Fiber Reinforced Ceramic (CFRC), also known as Carbon-Silicon Carbide (CSiC). The result is a material that can withstand temperatures of over 2,000°C, is 70% lighter than cast iron, and delivers outstanding quality and performance in a wide range of applications from friction applications within the automotive and aerospace industries to armored protection against high-velocity projectiles.
ST manufactures and supplies 3-D multi-directional carbon fiber and oxidized polyacrylonitrile (PAN) preforms to suit a variety of engineering applications. Carbon fiber preforms are mats of interwoven multi-directional carbon fibers (in the X-, Y-, and Z-axes), and are the basic materials that ST converts into ceramic brakes and discs using its patented technology. The carbon fibers in the mats are many times longer than the chopped fibers used in mold-cast carbon ceramic rotors, and are key to the strength and thermal advantages that CFRC rotors have over all other carbon ceramic rotors. These highly structured 3-D pre-forms are only possible in the precursor phase. Beyond the precursor stage, carbon fiber lacks the elongation properties needed to create the continuous woven and needled mats. This long fiber structure is kept for the entire production process until the rotor is finished.
PAN fiber sheets are needled together to create a PANOX preform. The future rotors are cut out of this preform. These “raw” discs are carbonized at more than 1500°C to convert the PAN fibers to carbon fibers. These carbonized rotors are then densified during a 14-day proprietary Chemical Vapor Infiltration (CVI) process. The rotors are then carbon-carbon. The rotors are then machined to the final geometry. Some faces are machined over thickness to allow for future machining.
Next, high rate silicon infiltration converts the carbon-carbon rotors to a carbon silicon carbide (CSiC) rotor within 16 hours. Melt infiltration with silicon is used for the formation of the ceramic phase. Molten silicon has a very low viscosity and will flow, water-like through the carbon composite, reacting with carbon to form silicon carbide. The design of equipment to facilitate this process and to deliver high quality composite materials is part of ST’s proprietary manufacturing process.
Finally, all faces are machined to the given tolerances and dimensions using polycrystalline diamond machine tooling which is required due to the hardness of the material. By manufacturing solid billets rather than molded castings, ST retains greater flexibility in the design and the dimensions of the brake discs. Finally, a strict x-ray scan and porosity check to ensure the same density throughout the entire rotor. By developing both discs and pads from its own CFRC materials, ST provides a balanced and high performance complete friction couple. ST recommends the Pagid STR-2 organic brake pad for use with CFRC brake discs.
Read More about CFRC Technology
Advantages of CFRC Rotors
Reduced Weight – The first improvement of a CFRC rotor over cast iron rotors is the reduced weight. The weight is reduced by approximately 50% over a same size cast iron rotor. So this means a savings of 9-18 pounds of rotating mass on each un-sprung corner of the car. As a result, the car feels as if it is “lighter”, responds better to the throttle, and handles significantly better. Handling is improved because the wheel is so much lighter, responds to the suspension springs faster, and follows the road much more closely. The next important advantage is the quicker steering response. Turning right and left is much “lighter” and the car turns in the desired direction much quicker and more accurately. Improved turn-in is a result of the reduced un-sprung weight and reduced gyroscopic effect of the high speed rotors. These are the advantages that you really feel; you don’t have to measure them. These advantages can be realized (and measured) in either improved performance or improved economy (fuel mileage). Economy improvements come from both overall vehicle weight reduction, as well as rotating mass reductions and their reduced acceleration loads on the engine.
Increased Life – A CFRC rotor is extremely strong and hard. Only polycrystalline diamond machine tooling is able to machine the surface of this rotor. The wear of this rotor is much less than the wear of a cast iron rotor. While replacing several cast iron rotors over the life of an automobile, the CFRC rotor can be left on the car and only the pads will ever need to be replaced. The fundamental difference between the CCB/CMC/CCM brake discs and the CFRC brake discs is that they are manufactured using discontinuous chopped carbon fibers where the ST discs are made of continuous carbon fiber woven into large mats. The mechanical integrity is superior because the strength of carbon lies in the direction and length of the fiber.
Since the structure of the CFRC rotor is the same friction material throughout the entire rotor, the lifetime is several times higher than the lifetime of the chopped fiber versions, which have friction surfaces laminated to their cores. The CFRC rotor can be re-surfaced several times, although this will take years of hard use and thousands of miles. In fact, CFRC rotors are durable enough to be transferred from car to car, as each car wears out, thus lasting the lifetime of multiple cars. All that is necessary is a change of hats and caliper supports.
Increased Thermal Capacity – As a result of the longer carbon fibers, the thermal conductivity and the thermal capacity of the CFRC rotors are much higher compared to ceramic rotors that are used on most production cars today. Those rotors are made out of a chopped fiber compound, so the fibers are much shorter, which results in poor thermal conductivity and low thermal capacity. The strength of those rotors is also reduced because of the lower material integrity. CFRC rotors can operate at much higher temperatures without damage to the brake, at 1200ºC disc surface temperatures. Ceramic brakes can store large quantities of heat so static and dynamic cooling is very important, as well as heat protection for other components near the brakes, such as wheel hubs and bearings.
The CFRC material is homogeneous, so it could theoretically wear down several mm with no change in performance. More importantly, the fibers are much longer, and transfer heat farther and faster than CCB and CCM, reducing heat buildup on the surface. CCB and CCM cannot reduce heat buildup as well, because of much shorter fibers in the composite, and the discontinuity between the friction surface laminate and the cast rotor core (in the case of the CCB). The specific heat of PANOX does not change, so that value is the same for CFRC, CCM, and CCB rotors.
Increased Thermal Conductivity – Another important advantage of the CFRC rotor is the much faster cooling compared to other ceramic rotors. The long fiber structure transfers the heat throughout the entire rotor quicker and thus dissipates the heat much quicker than a rotor with short chopped fibers that slowly transfers the heat. As a result of this intelligent design of the CFRC rotor, the performance and durability of the CFRC rotor is improved over normal cast iron rotors and other ceramic rotors, while brake fade and other heat-related issues are reduced or eliminated.
CFRC rotors do last longer on the track than other ceramic rotors, but not because they wear better. It’s because they transfer heat much better, and cannot de-laminate like some ceramic rotors (because they are not a laminate construction).
Resistance to Fading/Warping – CFRC rotors can operate with friction surface temperatures of 1200ºC without loss of friction performance, making them fade-resistant. The high thermal stability of CFRC also makes them resistant to warping, even at very high temperatures. However, brake pad material can accumulate in the minute pockets between the cross-weave on the surface of the CFRC rotor. The CFRC rotors can get thicker with use from the build-up of pad material. The rotors do not fade or warp, but the build-up can be un-even, which will feel like a warped rotor through the brake pedal. Also, excessive pad wear can be mistaken for brake fade and warped rotors. As the pads wear down, the pedal can get soft/spongy, and you can feel the normal vibration associated with thin pads. When using CFRC rotors, it is crucial that high performance brake fluid be used. The entire brake system is exposed to high heat and temperature under track conditions, so brake fluid can still boil for all the normal reasons (low grade Dot 3 fluid, old moisture-saturated fluid, contaminated fluid, etc.).
Reduced Cost – The Return On Investment (ROI) from CFRC rotors depends on how you use your brakes, which determines whether you will reach your break-even point. As an example, one driver went through 8 PCCB rotors ($32,000) in one year of track events. After switching to CFRC rotors ($24,000), the driver used the brakes for 17 months of track events, with no measurable wear. So, for that use case, the break-even point was reached very early. ROI can be improved in other ways: you only invest the time or money to install them once for the life of the car. That’s it. You never make that investment again (on that car). Also, you never risk losing time or money invested in a track weekend because your rotors wore out mid-weekend and you did not have spares.
[/quote]
http://www.speed-werks.com/carbon-fiber-reinforced-ceramic