Hp Question bolt on JHM b6 vs bolt on E46

B6/7 S4/RS4
#14

[quote=“euroswagr,post:10,topic:3494”]
I have been looking into cams and the only company that makes cams for this engine is Schrick. They advertise a 264 degree intake duration and a 272 degree exhaust duration which is measured at 0.004mm lift. Which a sport cam rather than a 300+ degree racing cam like what is offered for some of the older BMWs.

There was a tread on Audizine a few years ago where some guy got those cams put in and there was not much gain with whatever shitty tune that he had at the time. Also can’t find anybody other than a German company (motodyne doesnt count because they rip you off!) that offers those camshafts since Schrick has not responded to my messages. Let’s not forget to put in the camshafts it would either require an engine pull plus tear down or someone who has done it before since the timing chains are on the back.

#15

Jhm looked into it and said skip I believe (cams)…

1 nominal gains for huge cost
2 lumpy idle wouldn’t be well received by most Audi owners

#16

cams wont do much without headwork, gutless low end with a mild gain up top

#17
#18

[quote=nogarobeast]I have seen that vid and no its not a jhm b6. . . I would like to get my car in the 12s thats my goal! but im starting to think just buy a B8 s4 and do the tune and pully and thats it!! GAME OVER!!!
[/quote]
^^^yup, that’s the way to get into the mid 12s @ 112…and be $50,000 poorer.

#19

yeah the 317/310 was 91 octane w/ 91 tune, full boltons, and a 120*F intake manifold

the 100 octane pass was 327whp/338wtq on a 93 octane tune, with an iced intake manifold

#20

^^^yup, that’s the way to get into the mid 12s @ 112…and be $50,000 poorer.
[/quote]
Its funny how most everyone forgets that last part…lol

#21

What about my cam comment???

#22

I heard that JHM was working on cams and the engine builds but never heard any updates! Any word from them saki???

#23

exactly. Nogaro’s B6 would sell for a price that starts with a 1…and he’d then have to cough up another $30,000-40,000 to get in a B8. Then he’d need to cough up about $2000 for a tune and pulley…which would void his warranty on a relatively new car (so should he decide to sell his B8 in the next year or two, he’d be selling a car flagged as modded/TD1 and that’s certainly not a desirable trait for a car in most circles.

All of that to go 12.5 @ 112? I don’t get it.

With very mild modlists (EXCLUDING headers/spray/SC…literally just downpipes/catbacks/tunes/LW parts and for a couple an IM), we have these times in the 12.8-12.9 range, only 3 tenths and 3-4 mph behind those B8 S4s…but they’re $30,000 more money minimum.

v8s4ryan 12.8
euroswagr 12.8
cabracco 12.8
sakimano 12.9

I can promise you none of those cars had $10,000 in mods…let alone $30,000.

Hell buy a B7 Rs4 if you’re dumping $40,000+ onto the table. There are half a dozen RS4s with bolt ons who are down in the 12.2-12.5 range. We’re talking very basic mods here. Not to mention the motor can handle 500 whp according to the work being done on the superchargers in the UK, should you ever decide to go further.

What’s more interesting…a B8 S4 for $40,000 used + $2000 in mods to go 12.5…or a B7 RS4 for $40,000 + $2000 in mods to go 12.5? Want to put another $8,000-10,000 or so on the table? Sure…that’ll get you a bunch of bolt ons for the B8 that will get you down lower 12s, or maybe halfway to a B8 stage 3 kit (which doesn’t yet exist).

On the RS4 that $extra $10,000 will get you a supercharger kit strong enough to threaten the 10s…in a limited production rare as hell car that will be exciting 10 years from now, and will have a charisma that the B8 never will.

But the B8 does have a nicer radio.

#24

[quote=""]
LOK! Agreed.

#25

Ok, so now we have your goal which was all we needed. Now take a look at Saki’s post and there are your answers. I am non-header stock clutch.

I am almost positive with a JHM LWFW & clutch, headers, LW wheels and rear rotors I could be a 12.6 or faster all motor B7 S4.

We are just trying to help you answer your questions man.

…and if you can drop the change to buy a B8 and beat on it, by all means show us how it’s done!!

#26

What is kind of times are the fastest NA E46 M3s running? I’ve seen 12.7s, after that it’s all FI times. I’m sure getting down in that range is not cheap either.

#27

[quote=“euroswagr,post:25,topic:3494”]
Yes, please show us how it’s done…

#28

[quote=“primetime,post:27,topic:3494”]

;D

#29

My buddy has an E46 M3 and we have done quite a few pulls

my S4 (At the time)
. Catback
. Intake
. Suspension

His E46 (at the time)
. Suspension
. Catback

30-100 MPH pulls… dead even every single time… I would imagine, both bolted on and tuned they would remain equal. HOWEVER, in my opinion his car is more fun to drive. It’s more of a true race car feeling to it than my S4

#30

definitely more of a driver’s car, but the E46 doesn’t sound as cool (sounds frankly terrible) and isn’t nearly as comfortable when you push it. I don’t mean the seats…I mean the feeling of being comfortable controlling the car.

I traded with a friend for 3 days and frankly hated the E46. He loved my B7. He ended up selling his E46 shortly thereafter…for an E92 M3. A compromise of sorts :smiley:

#31

vdub, are you tuned? If not the races are what I’d expect frankly. The E46 doesn’t gain much with a tune, but the B6/7 S4 does with a JHM tune. I think it’s a factor of BMW offering a bit more out of the gate and Audi being a bit more conservative which is to be expected.

A tune and piggies added to your list, and I think the outcome would be pretty different, especially if you rowed the gears.

Also, what is you’re “intake”? Nothing you probably haven’t heard, but it’s probably hurting more than helping.

Vdub, in short:

E46 M3 vs B6/7 S4 with only catback performance mods run the same time. . . nothing shocking.

Frankly that’s good for you.
M3 has 333 crank and S4 has 340 crank
But S4’s additional weight and AWD drivetrain loss hurt you more. And the S4 probably has a worse stock catback which helped with you’re modification.

#32

when we raced neither was tuned. I now have a JHM tune and full 2.5" catless exhaust but we have yet to re-match. I have raced my friends e90 M3 with a tune and exhaust and it is still a veryvery close race

#33

here is justins car racing a well equipt M3
http://www.streetfire.net/video/b6-s4-vs-bmw-m3_203342.htm

as far as cams for our cars. I just don’t see us getting much. Inless we have more duration and I can’t see that we would need more considering the fact that we already have vairiable valve timing on the intake

having a 0 interference motor means not much more room for lift. So when you look at the available mods on the table you can have a nasty quick B6 S4 with what mods are available. Add for little money the JHM nitrous kit and your kicking ass on almost everyone.