Has anyone actually tried tuning the S6 with a gutted inlet manifold, not just running the car, but tuning to suit the open manifold…
Other than the possible missfires and the obvious loss of tq for having the shorter runners you dont need to tune for the shorter runners. the car will run and operate properly.
you can run say the JHM tune as its proven it self to be miles better than all the other tunes and delivers real world results both in dyno and actual tested acceleration. That will get you a good chunk of tq out of the car. But since the major loss in power is hardware related the only way your going to be able to gain all of that back is fixing the hardware. Not sure if that answers your question or not
So my 2 weeks of owner ship have been eventful, but the IM has been gutted of all plasty crappy flaps, completely gone with the actuators remaining but moving nothing. it was then reassembled and then reinstalled, found plenty of little things wrong so fixed most of these up…
There has been no codes or eng lights pop up, the death rattle noise is naturally gone.
difference in driving: Negs - The midrange has been changed, quite a bit - mainly at between 3-5000rpm, above 1/4 throttle… Its a bit “weezier” than before, also if you jam the hammer down at low RPMs it struggles to respond instantly. It is more noticeable in D mode which is keeping the Gearbox in higher gears with lower rpms. All makes sense re the physics…
Pros - The induction noise is actually better, sounds pretty good at lower revs even if its not performing as good. The response above 5000rpm is solid and instant, you can jam it on or build it…its almost as good performance wise if not greater than before. I cannot see the pictures of dyno charts from other posts, keeps coming up as a photobucket problem… be interesting to see those pics if HP is up at the top.
Also the economy has not really changed at all, cruising is the same as before…i imagine around town in the 2-5000range could be worse depends how you drive. There are no misses or coughs when driving at this stage, its harder to start when cold ie takes a few more seconds to fire up.
If you never knew this mod was done, you would not feel it unless you went from one car to another. The owner of the garage said he would not put a new manny in as they still are not bullet proof… and he didnt think the performance was worth the risk of intakes letting go…
Anyone have a bad IM lying in the garage doing nothing? im willing to spend some time creating an actual solution… we have talented out of the box thinking people here in NZ - im thinking an alloy solution should be created to solve it once and for all.
I researched dyno tunes and yep just as you said justin it wont do much, hardware is the issue, but the std ECU seems to handle the change. The shop did say they had leaks on the manny which required fixing and created eng lights.
My intentions: a new IM here in NZ is $8500 (none in country have to order them from somewhere…), one out of the US when and if its avaliable is around $3500NZ, plus install if I pay someone… At that price i cant really justify it if its going to let go again in 60,000miles…
We will see what audi say/do/release in Oct
hope this helps others
To help add to the conversation on things I think your talking about.
There is zero gain from pulling the flaps out hp wise. There is just the large loss of tq and throttle response down low as you mentioned.
While a new intake for you in NZ is expensive the new intakes have been updated and while I wouldnt use the words bullet proof I would consider them in much better condition than the eairly intakes.
Did you ever get the part number off your current intake… That will help but to be honest its most likely the older eairly release intakes. In your case I wouldnt hesitate to get a new intake from Audi. Keep in mind these older intakes do go bad but the new intakes have been updated and when you condisider the old original intakes broke after 75k of driving and no maintenance getting a new updated intake should last much longer now that we know to carbon clean the intake and valves.
Given the amount of power your looseing down low and the fact that colder weather misfires tend to be much worse with no flaps installed. I would see what you can do to search for a low mile new updated intake.
Input is always welcome - spec from the pros!
Roger that re HP on a gutted intake - I didnt double check the IM number as the shop did the work a bit quicker than expected. The car is a 07 so im guessing its an older manni…
I some how thought from the research that the newer manifold is still made from plastic, still breakable - or was there other improvements?
From what I can see on the JHM site and on here the part is undergoing another remake, I havent found any parts currently available im guessing Audi stopped making the part as they are redesigning it…
I would love to have it back to 100% - lets hope the new parts are nice and cheap ;-0
thanks for all the work and advice
I have the updated intake manifold and haven’t had any issues. Maybe that’s because the flaps will go bad with heat over the years ahead, but I doubt Audi would go through all of that trouble redesigning the part without taking these things into consideration. Ya never know though lol
yeah roger that - how long have you been running the updated?? cheers though - theres so few S6s here, everywhere you go people are very interested but know very little about em.
Im a little interested as to why audi are re-releasing/updating (according to JHM) the part again.
From what I understand Audi is obligated by federal law to support and have enough replacement parts for each model they make for up to 10 years. So with all the orders for intake manifolds it would make sense that Audi might consider getting the issue fixed so they don’t have to keep having them manufactured. It would save them money as the last S6 5.2 V10 stretches all the way to 2011 and Audi would have to have parts coverage until 2021
Also JHM really gets vested into these platforms so it wouldn’t surprise me to hear that JHM was submitting intake data to Audis intake manufacture. After all JHM makes a lot of replacement parts for all lines of Audis including having the blue prints to the All aluminum motors from the company that makes the motors for Audi and obviously there carbon fiber manual transmission parts.
The fact that JHM knows there is an update coming says something is going on. Will it be the end all fix who knows. The last version of the intakes still brakes but again we are looking at most intakes that have never had any cleaning or maintenance work done and cars with over 100k I think the story is going to be different when you get a new reman intake and actually clean it.
I donated my last IM to an engineer at Audi-HQ last year via my mechanic. I assumed it was for research.
…in North America.
From what I understand Audi is obligated by federal law to support and have enough replacement parts for each model they make for up to 10 years. So with all the orders for intake manifolds it would make sense that Audi might consider getting the issue fixed so they don’t have to keep having them manufactured. It would save them money as the last S6 5.2 V10 stretches all the way to 2011 and Audi would have to have parts coverage until 2021
Also JHM really gets vested into these platforms so it wouldn’t surprise me to hear that JHM was submitting intake data to Audis intake manufacture. After all JHM makes a lot of replacement parts for all lines of Audis including having the blue prints to the All aluminum motors from the company that makes the motors for Audi and obviously there carbon fiber manual transmission parts.
The fact that JHM knows there is an update coming says something is going on. Will it be the end all fix who knows. The last version of the intakes still brakes but again we are looking at most intakes that have never had any cleaning or maintenance work done and cars with over 100k I think the story is going to be different when you get a new reman intake and actually clean it.
[/quote]
Ah I see, the USA 10 year rule makes sense - and yes it would be idea that the Manny does get to a final solution prior to that 10 year rule becoming extinct, or we will have a bunch of wicked V10s running out of parts!
I thought the carbon clean was a inlet valve concern but the manifold must also require a good regular huck out…how often are you guys carrying this out?
I suppose the bright side needs to be focussed on here - parts are being updated and still being sold. It will give me some time to save up the pennys and get a new part when its available.
Thanks again for the intel
yeah right - nice, was there a large difference when you replaced your IM?
My original “M” version manifold had no issues with the flaps at 80k miles, but was replaced due to vacuum leaks at the corners.
ah roger that - thanks… bring on October!
Carbon cleaning is going to be different depending on your driving style and envirement. So mile wise your looking at about 35k pull the intake and inspect. Use some simple green on the instake spray it on the inside and then a quick spray with the garden hose usually gets everything else out. Let air dry for a bit and re install.
I have mentioned before I don’t really think there are going to be too many more issues once you take the time to do the maintenance. always remember these cars go about 100,000 miles before they usually get to guys who really do the maintenance and carbon work. If that had been done the entire time most of the issues we see now wouldn’t exsist.
[/quote]
Carbon cleaning is going to be different depending on your driving style and envirement. So mile wise your looking at about 35k pull the intake and inspect. Use some simple green on the instake spray it on the inside and then a quick spray with the garden hose usually gets everything else out. Let air dry for a bit and re install.
I have mentioned before I don’t really think there are going to be too many more issues once you take the time to do the maintenance. always remember these cars go about 100,000 miles before they usually get to guys who really do the maintenance and carbon work. If that had been done the entire time most of the issues we see now wouldn’t exsist.
[/quote]
Yeah for sure - im picking even our gas down this end of the world is going to have an effect, our lowest octane rating is 91 but the gas quality is trash compared to the US of A.
Simple green is amazing stuff - sounds like a easy bit of work to keep them running in top condition. I can see why people do high mileage in these cars, they are so comfy and actually really economical at cruise. I can average 21/22MPG when you drive it nice on longer trips - which is pretty much on par with my B6 S4.
My plan is to purchase a new manny when they are released, and hopefully a JHM tune, I see they can send the tunes to you which is amazing.
The JHM tune for the win. The JHM tune for the B6 S4 is AMAZING as well. JHM has the largest performance increase of any tune hands down bar none. It transoforms the car.
Just bought a B6 S4 today… Just waiting for the shop to go through it and tell me whether or not I should keep it. We’ll see within the next couple days I guess. I’ll be spending the next couple days going through the forums to figure out what’s what regarding this car. Also, let me know if anyone is selling their exhaust lol. This one came straight piped and I’m sure it won’t pass state inspection with those. Thanks.
just like with the S6 the B6 is the same.
Get what data you can from the shop and post it here. Your in super good hands with the B6 dare I say this but the B6 S4 is also a great car. I still cant bring myself to sell mine. I love it and there is unlimited potential for those cars JHM makes VERY THING for them.
I can work on mine with my eyes closed and JIMMY Bones is a regular on here he helps lots and lots of B6 S4 guys he has one two.
Whatever data you get make sure to post it here or ask here. We will all help you. And I do know someone that has a full exhaust and downpipes that would sell them. There FI units so the best exhaust there is. PM me if your interested. You should start a thread in the B6 sction.
not to sound too snoooty but I wouldnt waste time on other forums. All of the good technical guys left the other forums and came here. I saw you posted in the B6 section ill pop in that thread later tonight. CONGRATS