Skywagon's Return to the Dragstrip

Beautiful machine. Note…zero tire spin.

Saki, thanks. I think I understand all. I failed to properly post the videos for all to see. Will work on that as well as logging today. I appreciate everyone’s patience.

ah, thought jones was a 13. Auditude is not Ron. Auditude is Pete’s dad right?

Auditude is fastest. Facelift DSG
Jones is second. Original DSG
Rynurz third. Original DSG
Primetime fourth. Original DSG

GIAC has the facelift tranny figured out. APR and GIAC pretty equal otherwise.

Gents, Perhaps I could e-mail the videos to someone for uploading onto this site. However, I am restricted and unable to receive PMs. The quality would suffer but at least you’d be able to see them. May be an Audizine user could PM me their e-mail address? Thanks

You’ve supposedly already uploaded them to youtube, correct? So go watch them in youtube, and copy/paste the link to the video itself, not your youtube channel.

If you can watch them on youtube, so can we.

OK, I’ll give it a try. Thanks.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XxMxNfsHLt8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4fYGTFs9yVw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OmsUiO9bLjs

thanks for the video was hoping to see also the end but you cant have it all :wink:

Did the Vette run 120 trap based on the Timeslip you posted?

It worked, yeah! The vette and I ran against each other twice. I beat him once but on the run in the video I fouled and he had the better ET and speed. I’m sitting here looking at time slips and I think that was run 7 or 10? I’ve also noticed the times on the slip are not in proper order. Regardless, all the info. is there. Thanks

Saki your previous post (long one to sky) was very in depth and a good read. +Karma

thanks

the other tricks when looking at timeslips…

330 foot time

This is around 5 seconds on these cars. That means you’re going around 70 mph or so…and have cleared 1st gear and are well into 2nd gear. This also means any spinning/trouble launching is over and you’re moving.

I figured out a long time ago that I could extrapolate my 1/8 and 1/4 mile time from my 330 foot time. I have a test area where I can rip through 1st and 2nd pretty easily, but running to 1/8 or 1/4 mile not so much. If I ever want to use my PBOX and see what I can do in the 1/4 mile, I can just run 330 and calculate.

B7 RS4
330’ time x 2.38 = 1/4 mile ET (660 feet)
330’ time x 1.54 = 1/8 mile ET (1320 feet)

B8 S4 manual and DSG very similar numbers.

the B67 S4 is a little different…about 2.40 x 330’ = 1/4 time. A bit less efficient at the top end acceleration.

This also allows us to see if a car is dying up top because 1st and 2nd go by quickly and are torquey and launchey, however once you’re out there in 3rd and 4th you’re just living at top end, and any misfires/boost bleedoff/timing pull are going to show up like a wart when we compare your 330 time to 660 and 1320.

Similar to this is the 1/8 vs. 1/4

1/8 ET x 1.55 = 1/4 ET
1/8 MPH divided by 0.785 = 1/4 MPH

So on cars like Skywagon we can see where his trouble is. With those 1.67-1.68 60’ times we can see his torque numbers are monstrous and he’s rocking. On pace to match the fastest of the fast (11.5-11.6).

By the time he hits 330’, he has lost some of that excitement, but his 4.94 and 4.96 330’ times mean he’s on the way to a solid 11.7 ET. But he went 11.98 and 12.0…which is more like 2.42 x his 330’ time. Something’s wrong.

The 1/8 mile again…shows he has lost even more, but even there, he lost some time and MPH between 1/8 and the finish. None of the numbers lined up…so something’s wrong with the car’s ability to produce HP.

These are not 100% rules, but they’re pretty good.

p.s. this is how I originally caught kevkev…the ratios were off and made no sense.

I dont really know much about the 1/4 and times. However, reading this thread there is SO much useful knowledge and learning. For someone who doesnt understand why the 1/4 is so coveted by AR, this is the thread they should read (or possibly a sub thread made so those who dont could understand more easily).

Also Sky not how your rating has been climbing from all the useful info you have posted recently? No one is out to get you. People just need to learn that this site is a bunch of alpha males and its better to listen and learn (i try to do). Nice to see your rates turn around and again congrats on you 11 second run!

Great post sakimano. Very valuable.

Drob23 said everyone should get on the same page for what Skywagon should be expecting. I think this thread is ment to help do that. Also it would be good to put in that sakimano wrote

http://audirevolution.net/forum/index.php?topic=2656.0

The below link leads to logs…I think. Had some LC problems and short shifting but I think it’s due to transmission temperature getting too warm. Also had one very strange run with the RPM bouncing around at 5300 RPM. % runs here.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B3FHtryJGyvkYXZTVkVLT3dFelk/view?usp=sharing

Interesting… Doesn’t look like a bypass issue… On iPad so reviewing sucks… Will use the wife’s laptop when she gets home, can you email them to mustanggtron@yahoo.com. No air mass values, I think the wrong field? No iats either… Car was up to temp? No timing pull… This is 93 and 93 tune? W/m?

Ron, will e-mail. Lots of numbers 2 pages. Iat 47F Hum 56% DP 32F Baro 29.98 Absolute pressure 101 kpa. Elev 30 ft. Car well warmed. This is REVO’s 93 tune, burning 93 octane no Ethanol. At track 104 sunoco and 100+ octane tune used. Hope this helps.

.I think I saw somewhere that the revo tune used more fuel to try and keep the car safer. Maybe check the AFR. If the car is running super hot the car might be running super fat and that would slow the car down

Damn, I didn’t have time to look through these at home where I have a tool to plot the logs.

So looking at them, here’s what I see:

  1. The bypass issue has been largely addressed. There are still instances where RFP_AV becomes non-zero during your pulls, but it’s arguably insignificant (mostly less than 4 deg for no longer than 2 time steps = .4 sec). This could be during a shift.

  2. You are seeing some timing pull from knock sensors, which is a really good thing. This is the 93 file, as you said, so maybe this never happens on the face file? I see this around 293 sec.

  3. Your ignition timing total isn’t very high. You are seeing a maximum of about 16 deg during your pulls, but in general the avg is pretty low. I wonder if this is where you’re leaving something on the table? Would be interesting to compare with logs from the race tune.

  4. You are getting some misfires in the totalizer, probably insignificant. But you get around 4-5 here and there. The logs from the blown engine had 200 misfires, so yours is probably fine. Kind of strange right at 258 sec, where you are getting tons of boost, doubtful much acceleration and then the misfires jump right after you shift or lift.

  5. This is strange, but look between about 209 and 217 seconds. You are clearly not accelerating, due to RPM’s hanging around 4-5k, but your bypass stays shut and your ignition angle stays around 7 deg. I wonder if the tune thinks you are “about” to accelerate, but giving you quite a bit of boost for no reason.

I’m honestly not that clear on how you calculate the boost from your measurements. I believe you need to have ambient pressure. So maybe Ron knows better. Once I get some time, I’ll try to plot to illustrate my points with graphs. Good job again for providing the logs, proving that sky can be an asset to the community.

Sky, OK looked at these a little more this morning…

Boost bypass isn’t a problem at least not on these logs… You’re seeing a little but it’s pretty insignificant compared to the other Revo logs I have, which were 93 also… Timing is on average slightly lower than the other Revo logs by about 1-2 degrees… You also show some pull in one of the runs so that is a good sign as it’s the first I’ve seen… Not sure why it was pulling, would be nice to have had IAT’s and airmass… Next time use 134 for air mass not 136, you want just “air mass kg/h” not “air mass integral specified”… Are you shifting the car or letting it shift itself? There are 4 runs here but two of them really are not good as you shift gears way to fast and at to low of an RPM… Boost values don’t look bad… The misfires make me a little nervous as that is not good, but not sure what the cause is? Most of them occur when you aren’t even WOT but a few are and looks like in the one case they happen right after/during a shift and there is 0 timing and 10% bypass…

Good work on doing these and I certainly appreciate it… Do you have any race gas you can try the same on the race tune? Make sure to get the air mass and IAT if you do more please… Honestly, these are much different then I expected and really no tell tale signs at least that I can see sticking out…

Does super fat mean super rich? Thanks