dunno. but I hear it’s not the flywheel
post up a log of 3rd gear maybe, logging blocks 003 and 021 for us. Would be interesting to compare.
regardless what you run with that kit, please post it up and dont be shy. we all here want to see the advancement of the 4.2 and could guide you to what migh tbe going wrong. even if it lays an egg, the hardware is good and we can all help advance it along. the tts kit is gorgeous, better be for the price, but the level of engineering in the kit is jaw dropping.
as for that race, the c63 crushed it. customer of mine has a tuned c63 with cat-back and gutted cats (yes we did piggy pipes on a c63 lol) and it cant hold a candle to my car. he just ordered headers which we will be installing in the coming weeks, once he gets those in, ill get some pulls for you all on video but they would have to work a miracle to make up that kind of difference. if that rs4 is making the power it claims, he should annihilate the benz. but also being french, they are known to give up easily so that wouldnt surprise me either lol
[quote=“91gl,post:50,topic:3163”]
ROTFLMAO!
C63 + MHP headers (best) + MHP exhaust (one of the best if not the best) + tune = serious car
Not sure what mods are on the local car you piggied.
Look at the proliferation of MHP cars on this 10.X to low 11.X list
http://www.dragtimes.com/Mercedes-Benz--C63-AMG-Drag-Racing.html
As you can see here, they’re about 440-470 wheel horsepower
http://www.dragtimes.com/Mercedes-Benz--C63-AMG-Dyno-Sheets.html
I didn’t get clarification but it looks like the Benz didn’t have a passenger. To that end, the RS4 had 120 lbs of avant weight (vs. an RS4 sedan’s weight for example) working against it + it looks like 175lbs of extra passenger weight. 300lbs is no joke.
I think you’re right though, I also think the RS4 should have done better. That’s why I’m a bit worried about the MRC tune on the TTS cars. When the hardware looks right but the car doesn’t seem to do what you expect it to (think APR SC when it first launched), it has to be the tune. Hopefully this was just a case of not really being a great driver in the RS4 which was already fighting a weight penalty…and it was up against a very stacked low 11 second C63.
FWIW… MHP powered C63 went 5.98 60-130 recently according to Andy at MHP… I know alot of folks don’t like them but I have known Andy for a long time and used to drag race Mustangs with him in the early 2000’s…
good ron then you can tell andy and the rest of that bullshit company that they’re fucking thieves
I hear ya, MHP headered MBs are no joke. They know what they are doing.
maybe in the MB world but they’re damn good at bricking multiple rs4 ecu’s…
Interesting… Do you have more details on this? You should post in the clutch question thread.
Rich, I knew that wouldn’t sit well with you… I know Andy had a RS4 at one point and heard about some of the horror stories… I have no business dealings with him just used to race with him and still keep in touch… Sorry you got f***ed over…
The merc is a fast as hell car for sure. I think we also have to add into the equation that as well as the extra weight the rs4 is also loosing a little more through the drive train with the 4wd system as well. I’m not sure what the normal losses are with the 2wd sytem on the merc. Does anyone know? Not trying to justify why he got beaten so badly but I wasn’t there so cant really comment. But I heavily suspect that on that particular video the driver played a large part in the distance at which he ended up at.
Regarding the tune and MRC. Based on what I have seen through the development phase of our kit I wouldn’t be quite so quick to jump on mrc and blame it all on the software. Obviously what with mrc being heavily involved with the pes stuff before, we where able to look in quite some detail at where the major issues where with there product as a back to back against our own. The obvious one as everyone knows is that the blower was just too small for the job. Couple that with what is not a very efficient supercharger (especially when you start over spinning it to the degree that some of there kits where) and that supercharger starts having to work pretty hard and with it starts generating allot of heat as its well outside its peak efficiency range. On top of this in my personal opinion the heat exchanger was not in the slightest bit optimised. The pre rad was I believe a cheap item that you can readily buy off eBay ect and the actual heat exchanger core in the manifold was pretty thin with not a great amount of surface area. These things all add up to a kit that would be capable of running reasonable numbers if you where to do a quick run on the dyno with a fairly cold engine, and maybe this explains why the dyno numbers never stacked up to the real world performance?
For sure the rs4 and s5 kits are heavily compromised because of packaging restraints, and this will always limit how effective the charge cooler system will be, but you only have to look at the size of the pre rad, and the depth of the cores in the TTS kit to notice that we have tried to optimize it as much as we possibly could. For example I know that on the road we could do a rolling start in 2nd gear and take it to the limiter in every gear and by the time we got into 6th we where just about hitting the same air inlet temps that mrc had seen on a hard pull in one gear with the pes system. These numbers are still what I would consider pretty high compared to a Well setup intercooler install but an intercooler was a definite no go unless you cut half the front of the car off Couple this with the heat recovery time in the systems and you can start to piece together why the TTS system can work so much better, this is exactly why our system incorporates items such as the 6mm PTFE gaskets that separate the main plenum assembly from the heads. In testing we saw This makes a HUGE difference to heat recovery times as we are no longer using the aluminium plenum chamber as a giant heat sink for the engine 
Back on track…This is why in ’my’ belief mrc are not really to blame for the poor performance of these previous kits as it was more limited on actual hardware design rather than software. They just got hot so quick that you have to start pulling timing out to keep them safe.
That’s my take on it anyway. But please feel free to discuss it further as I would be interested in others opinions.
^I don’t think anyone is going to say MRC isn’t a capable tuner b/c of their attempt to improve the PES kit’s performance. We all knew the kit was a failure before it ever bolted onto the car. Then when some impressive dyno numbers started coming out, it appeared that it might not be as black & white. But the resulting 1/4 times, and head to head pulls made it obvious that it was indeed what everyone suspected in the beginning.
What people are trying to say is that just b/c you have a great history in other platforms, or appear to really know your stuff, doesn’t always translate to other platforms (i.e. the RS4). This became blatantly apparent with APR’s S/C kit. To think about a company the size of APR, who only specialize in Audi/VW/Porsche, decided to make a dedicated supercharger kit for the RS4/S5, actually released and sold the kit to customers, and then found out that the tune wasn’t performing like the hardware should (and couldn’t figure out why or how to fix it), it became obvious that all the pieces don’t always fall together like you’d hope sometimes. Lack of tuning expertise was expected from PES/VF/Etc, but it was flat out embarrassing for something like this to occur to APR.
So no one is saying MRC won’t be able to tune the kit effectively, just that several have gone in with great track records, backing, and know how, but ended up with results that were lacking greatly.
drivetrain losses don’t matter if we’re talking wheel horsepower. You guys dyno’d around 480 hub hp…which would be around 470 wheel horsepower. The Benz should be good for a solid 450-470 WHP. Similar there. Weight being the biggest difference (and torque…the Benz’ torque is likely around 50 wtq stronger down low (at the start of the pull)
^Good point, forgot to post about the “dtl” issue.
Yet again. . . why whp is always best as it makes for a direct comparison side to side.
tough to say. Tuning a 2.7T RS4 and picking up gains is not the same as tuning a 4.2 that has had a supecharger added to it.
Even then, their 2.7T cars don’t seem to light the world on fire. Are there any fast 2.7T MRC times? I couldn’t find any better than 12 seconds at Santa Pod.
Here’s an MRC tuned B5 S4, stage III car. Wasn’t even close to the SC B6 (except for when the B6 waited for him to catch up).
i remember all the hopes and dreams they promised you. i didnt want to say anything but i knew they were full of it. i believed the tune and headers and all, but they also told you ITB’s which is when i thought to myself, this company should just stick to c63’s lol.
yea shame on me cus i really should have known better.
I must have missed that whole thing. I was probably not allowed to talk about/think about RS4s back then because RS4power said so (since I only owned an S4)
That’s right, 50 lashes for you