Sorry we worked on so many products at once.
B8 S5+B7 RS4+B8 RS5+R8 4.2 = I would hazard, a market more likely to modify extensively. The only exception might be the S5 which is big volume (relatively speaking, to the RS4 for example) but they don’t seem to embrace acceleration part as much as they do stance. And cats.
I have seen maybe 10 people on forums put their hand up for stage 3 on the B8 S4. Many of those won’t do it. You are on that list. You just said above you probably won’t do it, and said the same a few months ago. So I’m not sure it will be as popular with the S4 crew as you think. It’s currently, typically, a leased car for a new purchaser in the entry level luxury segment. While volumes are huge, they’re mostly like your wife who you said drives yours now. Not likely going to modify it. When they’re $25,000 and ar a graduation car for the B5 kids and whomever else moves up from the B6/7 S4, it is then that I think the B8 will take off, as will stage 3 kits.
I guess we’ll see. APR sold over 100 of the old 1320 RS4 supercharger kit…and it was like $19,000 for much of that…and was a smallish blower that everyone complained about because it didn’t take advantage of the car’s headroom. I would imagine the market for the 1740 on now 5 year old RS4s that can be had for $30,000 by hardcore performance people is going to be very interesting to watch.
They’ve sold half a dozen already and they haven’t even told us the price.
Hey just saying…you are doing an awesome job with the other platforms…gotta keep the pressure on you…
But what if the 4.2 development was actually quicker or easier for APR? What if there are issues with the 3.0t that they’re trying to iron out?
To be honest, I feel bad for the 3.0T guys. This stage III kit was initially promoted as being for their platform…must be a year ago now. Then the RS5 and R8 jumped in front of the line, which I guess was annoying for the B8 S4 guys, but hey, them’s the breaks.
Now, out of the blue, the first car with the kit to show anything is the B7 RS4 and the B8 has been pushed back a couple more times.
Here’s the first thing we saw, December 2012. “Teaser: APR 3.0 TFSI Stage III Supercharger System”
Sakis I would bet you a brick of coke there are more tuned B8 S4s than there are a total amount of B7 RS4s in North America. Consider that there are probably only 2/3 or so of the original RS4s still on the road, after 6-7 years since release.
And also consider that the enthusiasts who would have been willing to spend on the blower, many are leaving. Think about those who have either one foot out the door (ie Primetime) or have taken their disposable income and gone to more expensive platforms (81bear, psyk, well armed, etc). Think of all the people who didn’t balk at paying 1500 for a tune and pushing APRs take on the B8 S4 tune to seven figures $$, who knows how many times over now. Those people would have the funds for a blower and APR is losing those people. Especially if someone rockets to a mid-11 on pump…imagine the buzz.
Even looking at the 1/4 mile list, there haven’t been an S or RS car with these sorts of enthusiast numbers since the B5 S4. But the top people are leaving…
I don’t think APR is at risk of losing anyone. Look at the B7 RS4 platform. It’s a 5-6 year old car, and it was only recently that the supercharger options have arrived on the scene.
The B8 S4s are not going anywhere - only to different owners, many of whom will no doubt be looking to mod. That’s kind of how the cycle goes, right?
Not sure what a brick of coke looks like, but I usually bet cans or cases.
There were 2500 RS4s sold in North America.
Apr just clipped 1000 tunes worldwide on the 3.0T…if my memory serves, so whatever that brick is, you owe me it.
For two, why are there only 2/3 of the RS4s still on the road? Were they prone to spontaneous combustion or something? Mine isn’t, fortunately. Or do you maybe mean it’s such a museum piece that they are on display in various fine garages and institutions. You may be right about that.
I know what you mean about the enthusiasts leaving the platform but as I said, you guys are a tiny fraction of the population and we’re making bigger comments about the platform, rather than your view of your tiny circle of extreme enthusiasts like Primetime, 81, richi and a few others.
Buying an ECU tune (which lots of people have done) vs. tearing your car appart and putting a $20,000 supercharger kit on it on a platform where people freak the fuck out if a warranty claim for a thermostat is denied are 2 very different propositions.
Frankly, I don’t think 81 would have gone stage 3. He sold the car 6 months ago and bought an M3. He was looking at GTRs before Arin teased the stage 3 kit. You are another example…you not only wouldn’t have gone stage 3 in my opinion…you went backwards to stage 0 after REVO blew up your motor. You didn’t put APR stage 1 or 2 back on your car. So i don’t see it that it would have been automatic.
The real reason APR pushed you guys to the backburner is actually pretty simple now that I think about it. Where the hell are you going to go? On the other side of that, if I own an RS4 (fortunately I do) I have LOADS of monster power options now, and APR didn’t want to probably sit back and watch TTS, AVIVA and JHM eat their lunch.
Exactly what I’m referring to
You have new B8 S4s that were $60,000 bought by well healed people who can certainly afford a $15,000 blower kit…but are they really going to go through with it? Sure a few will.
Then you have 5 years from new when the B8 S4 is $24,000 and the kit is $15,000…that’s a younger crowd, and a more aggressive crowd. Do they buy a new M3 V6tt for $65,000 or buy a B8 S4 + $15,000 1740 kit?
This is why Audi sells cars like the RS5/RS4 with NA engines and don’t care about people who bitch and whine that it’s not forced induction. Audi isn’t selling to the forced induction fans/fast and furious modification hungry crowd for the most part. They’re selling to people who won’t mod their cars, primarily. Sure a few will wish they could and will call the NA cars fail, but lets face it, it is the 2nd and 3rd generation owners who push platforms to new heights. That’s what the RS4 is seeing right now.
Take the B6 S4. You can buy one for $10,000. You can do a JHM motor build with a sleeved block and forged everything for $15,000. You can go JHM stage 3 800 hp supercharger kit for $15,000. That’s $40,000 and you’re going to obliterate all of us who are posting in this thread. That’s where a platform takes off. Not the first guys.
This is right on the money…look at the B5 S4. It was a 12 second dog with a few guys with $15,000 APR stage 3 kits on their $40,000 B5 S4s in the mid to early 2000s. In the late 2000s when it was $15,000 to buy the car, nevermind a K04 kit, the B5 really took off. VAST erupted. JHM became a big player. The platform got into the low 11s. Count VOhn created his GT B5 S4 and trapped 135. A couple of guys pushed into the 10s. This was the renaissance. Not the first business guys who bought APR stage 3 and went 12.4 @ 113 in 2004.
I think we should start a new thread on this. Too much good sutff.
I don’t want to stop your momentum here sakis, and I don’t disagree with a lot of what you wrote.
Except one thing. There is no doubt in my mind there are more tuned S4s than total B7 RS4s on the NA roads. That was almost 2 years ago that APR talked about having sold 1000 tunes, IIRC, when REVO and GIAC were releasing. Consider those guys have sold a number of tunes, and APR has sold more still. Who knows, the number might even be 3000 cars with TD1 by now lol. Arin might share, he knows for sure what APR have sold, and probably have a good idea about the others. The blow is owed in my direction.
There is a ridiculously eager market for the S4…this is nothing like you can compare to the last generations of S in terms of the total value of the market, only 4 years in. When a product is released, the B8 S4 market explodes from pent-up demand, every time. And there is nobody else even close to releasing anything remotely stage III yet. And nobody has had the hype of stage III either. Don’t forget you would still have a healthy side business of 3.0Ts in the A6, Q5, Q7 (I would love a 3-row 500+ hp beast, v6 or V8).
Later on, the margins suck, since everyone and their mother sells for the stage III game. I don’t think APR gave much of a fuck about the B5 for the last few years, since there’s little to no money in it. And they are already late to the big blower RS4 game, it seems.
It would suck to have to wait until 6 years in to get blower options, like you with the RS4. And already 4 years have gone by in our case…
The blower won’t cost as much on the 3.0T, and it’s a drop-in affair. I’ve swapped pulleys and gotten pretty fast at it, but for the blower install it would be easy as shit. And easily reversible. This isn’t like doing stage III on a 2.7T, which involves a motor pull every fucking time something goes wrong.
Anyway my point is APR has given us B8 S4 owners the bluest set of balls in 2013 while they release the blower and other stuff on other platforms…sucks to wait. I’d like to bitch about it so let me.
Forget where in AZ i first saw it but it was teased long before dec 2012. Think closer to sept oct 2012. I almost wanna say expected released in last 2012
APR said there were 1000 tuned 3.0T cars not that long ago I thought. Certainly not 2 years ago. That’s all of earth by the way…you’re quoting north american RS4s vs all of earth tuned 3.0T cars for some reason as if it means something, market wise. The real deep pockets are around the world, and there are 10,0000 RS4s on the planet. APR has more supercharged RS4s OUTSIDE of the US than they do inside it. Consider that for a while. When you consider TD1 has just come on the scene in the last 12 months, that has scared away lots of the casual buyers.
You should start a couple of poll threads on Audizine.
- What Tune do you have?
a) APR
b) GIAC
c) REVO
d) JFONZ
e) EPL
f) ASP
g) other (MTM, ABT etc)
h) NONE - stock
and then another one
- Will you go APR stage III in the next 12 months if it’s launched today
a) Yes, if it’s $8,000 or less
b) Yes, it it’s around $10,000 or less
c) Yes, if it’s around $12,000 or less
d) Yes, if it’s around $15,000 or less
e) Yes, money no object
f) No, I am staying stage 2
g) No, I am staying stage 1
h) No, I am staying stock
I think you’ll see the numbers aren’t exactly what you thought they would be. I also think you’ll see lots of ‘Yes if it’s around $8000 or less’ answers…but not many willing to pony up $12,000-15,000. Don’t forget a bunch of you B8 S4 guys were saying ‘it’s only going to be around $6,000-8,000’ and that got lots of noobs excited. Why pay $4000 for stage 2 + exhaust when you can get stage 3 for only $2000-4000 more? But that’s not the way it’s going to shape up, is it.
When (and if ;D )the StgIII is released for the B8 S4, I have been told several times from reliable sources that it will be right about $8995, definitely under $10k. Only for the B8 S4, and if you are already APR Stg1 or 2. This is due to the simplicity of the upgrade for our platform, i.e., no need for injectors, fuel pump, and other items that a N/A motor would need to switch over to FI…
Its basically the new S/C with a larger TB, gaskets and the software update. Claimed to be an estimated 30min install ;D you can update the software while the other person swaps the charger lmao!
FWIW, although I am not one of the “bigshots”, definitely not wealthy, mostly read through the forums and post very little… I would do whatever it takes to be one of the first with this StgIII upgrade. I love these cars and enjoy/appreciate the amazing performance from this highly efficient engine. I’ve owned for almost 2 years and still puts a smile on my face driving mach speeds to work 8) Hell yes I would sell my left nut for this damn thing!!! Anything to be the fastest 6MT!!! mauahhaahaha!!!
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Lol that was westwest…I can’t believe you claim he speaks for the rest of us or gets even noobs excited…shame
Ad…that’s what scares me. If you’re right about not needing injectors or fuel pump, then you have to consider it has less than a 25% power bump.
Because that’s pretty much all we have left on our fueling, that’s a given when we were told that there isn’t enough room to do an e85 tune.
Good Point, however, it could be just enough to get just under 500awhp, on 93oct. And according to Arin, it makes loads more torque from idle to redline… I honestly think the goals have been met and now its the finer fine fine tuning that needs to be finished.
I am still very curious about this kit in the DSG cars… wasn’t it mentioned about a test car in Australia that was DSG equipped STG3? Wondering if that’s the REAL hold-up? Torque limits of the DSG?
Shit, if that’s the case, us 6MT guys should get it first!!! ;D That should make up for the disgusting 60ft time and the light-speed shifts achieved by the those fuckers! lmao
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are you kidding?? El ROmano, right above me, just said the price starts with an 8. There are a bunch of ou B8 S4 guys who made that claim.