GIAC Stage 2 with AWE Tuning Pulley

B8 S4
#1

So as we all know, AWE is on the verge of releasing their new Pulley Upgrade along with a GIAC reflash. After some drama last week between the pulley release and testing, I have spoken to Austin @ GIAC and Jesse @ AWE and they were very nice and helpful on getting things cleared up. Since my car has the Testpipes and CPS they didn’t want my car to be first so the numbers are realistic, however they expect my car to see great power gains over a Tune/Pulley only car. Once the Stock DSG and 6MT make their way down to Willow Grove, PA and things look good I will be heading down there for the pulley install and some Dyno pulls before and after…

Once this is done me and Tsivas will be doing a full breakdown of before and after Logs and Vbox runs on both 93 and 100. The Dyno numbers will be useless IMO besides the comparison between Stage 1 and Stage 2 on the same day.

My car was running great until my recent install of my APR CPS and 034 Testpipes. I am not getting any codes- only the 02 codes for being catless. The car is seeing gains down low however above 110mph in 4th and especially from 120-130mph range the car seems to be hitting a brick wall. At first we thought it was due to bad gas however the problem is evident even on race gas and with minimal to no timing pull…

After talking to Austin and sending him some logs, and from the information me and Tsivas gathered my bypass valve was opening up to 25% on some runs. At points barely making 12.5psi. Car is still moving but almost NO performance gain with the Testpipes and CPS. It seems the reason for this problem is torque overload, my car is reaching a max torque for Stage 1 and the ECU was trying to cut back. GIAC is currently writing me a new updated 1+ map and we will be testing that tomorrow night. If all goes well I am expecting some good numbers. We will get sufficient logs and vbox runs tomorrow, also some 30-130 runs starting in 3rd so we can see what gains we will see with the pulley in that down low rpm range where it ‘should’ shine.

Now it’s just a waiting game, but I am very happy with how AWE Tuning and GIAC handled the situation and explained what the deal was, Austin and Jesse in particular.

Stay tuned for some extensive testing and I’m looking forward to providing some good data for everyone here. Thanks guys and I will update this thread whenever I get more information.

PS: We saw very good gains with an APR Stage 2 car with headers over a similarly equipped car without headers. I’m hoping we see similar gains with the GIAC Stage 2 upgrade. Competiton is great for the community and even better when those two competitors are two great company’s like GIAC/AWE and APR.

We will also do a in depth comparison between similarly equipped GIAC Stage 2 and APR Stage 2 cars… As long as we can get Richi out to our test track again :wink:

#2

Thought you had the pulley already. So this is a future thread?

Just a question…why was your car making gains in the lower gears, but was only hitting a ‘torque limit’ in the higher gears?That doesn’t make sense.

#3

Glad to hear you got what you wanted. Looking forward to seeing the delta.

#4

I doubt it’s a torque limit thing… Your peak torque (Nm) was about 565 based on the 93 pump file you sent me.

My stage 1 on pump was hitting 560 Nm with just intake and exhaust and would hit 14.5 psi peak of boost.

Stage 2… hit 617 Nm on pump and 665 Nm on race gas.

I think it’s just a bypass and cold weather issue. I would also make sure the CPS is functioning properly.

#5

Don’t forget though Tsivas, your tune is APR, his is GIAC.

Maybe GIAC left a limiter in there that APR eliminated.

#6

True… Didn’t think of that.

#7

Have you guys logged requested and actual boost? how does it look in the higher RPM range?

#8

I second looking at IATs as a source of the load table (torque map, load map, whatever you want to call it) being limited (bypass valve opening, in the case of the B8 S4).

But also I point to evidence of past logs (not sure who’s seen what), on two different GIAC cars, I see the bypass valve opening in just normal conditions…add super cold conditions and its just opening even more. The load table is just too wimpy, and leaves so much on the table.

Anyone who’s seen APR version 1 will have experienced this.

I think GIAC just didn’t learn from the APR v1 to v2 debacle, and will fix this mistake now. Not having a shop car up north all winter at AWE didn’t help them, I’m sure. But I’m sure they’ve seen your 60-130 tests, boys.

Damn you guys type too fast. Agree with bears advice. The requested mani pressure is basically the main output of your load table…

#9

Will tomorrow night. When Pbox involved the logging sessions are usually neglected or rushed by others ;). Just doing straight logs tomorrow night. If and when we finish… maybe entertain pbox if it’s not too late.

#10

Nope, no pulley for me. Was going to switch over to APR this week from GIAC Stage 1 but I decided to wait it out because of some high hopes from AWE/GIAC.

I’m not 100% sure what the issue was, but I remember Austin mentioning that it made sense the issue was happening in 4th rather than lower gears… Not 100% sure why or what is happening but we will find out tomorrow if the problem is resolved.

#11

Agreed, I believe that’s what the issue is. Not sure if APR eliminates the torque limit completely or if they just set it higher.

#12

We will be doing this tomorrow night with the new flash and hoping the issue is all but gone…

#13

You’ve just reached the limit of their load table. I’m pretty sure of this. It’s just that their limit is a lot lower than others.

Tsivas hit the limit of the load table too, on APR S2V2, it seems. But that was pretty extreme conditions and I’m sure APR hadn’t envisioned -2500 DA as their tuning focus.

It’s possible that you are hitting some other safety limit, but consider you need more than 80 degC IAT to hit the safety limit there, or possibly some AFR issue from you running O2 spacers. But eventually you’d get a CEL, you’d think.

#14

I have no 02 spacers but I do have a CEL for 02 but that shouldn’t be affecting performance according to GIAC and APR. My IAT are normal.

#15

The CEL is for a catlayst efficiency code which is not hurting, just annoying.

#16

*so long as you’re on a test pipe file, IIRC.

#17

I am not on a Testpipe file.

#18

Come to think of it…have any of you logged the (modeled) EGT? I remember being very close to 1000 degC, when logging the S2V2 beta…which “may” also impose a throttle/bypass restriction limit…I’d imagine a headers/test pipe car could be in a worse state than a cat car.

#19

J - let me know if there is anything else you want logged. Gonna be a busy night. I won’t overwhelm the sampling either.
Do a few at at time.

RPMs
Boost specified vs requested
A/F ratio
Timing
Timing Correction Factors Cylinders 1-6
MAF Kg/h
IAT
EGT
Torque Nm
Bypass

#20

The APR test pipe file only prevents the CEL from lighting up the dashboard, that’s all.