JCviggen's misano B7 RS4 - work in progress

[Swordfish]

Hi JCViggen…I used to be a Volvo guy ( T5-R and R ) so I remember you from the Volvo forums . I guess we both migrated to Audi’s eventually owning both Rs6 and Rs4’s . I’m still amazed that your T5-R almost went flat 8 at the Nordschliefe ! and I also just saw your Misano on Boris’ Youtube video…very cool indeed ! you know the Ring quite well man . Props ! I’m planning on being there mid Spring for a few laps.

Do you by any chance remember a guy named Florian ? he had a green 850 T5-R estate, 5spd, caged, very fast around a track as well ?

Cheers !

Mike

[mattshaver]

Gearbox came off for what I believe was the 3rd time in 12 months to replace the flywheel. Last thing I could think of to explain the terrible shift quality. I had initially tried to get a new LUK flywheel that would be identical to OEM but it turns out they’re not sold in Europe. Probably there’s a contract somewhere that says they aren’t allowed to sell them direct to customers for less than half what Audi wants for it and it doesn’t apply to the US.
After shipping and import taxes this didn’t look like a great idea.

Then I came across a company in the UK that makes billet single-mass flywheels that are a direct fit replacement for the OEM dual mass. So you use the standard DMF clutch but you lose a couple KG on the flywheel (somewhere in beteen OEM and a very light aftermaket one) and the only price to pay is a bit of chatter at very low revs. Beautifully made flywheel it is, too, and it only cost me something like 420 USD shipped to my door so it was cheap to boot.

During maintenance a leaking rear shock was found and had to be replaced. Expensive thing to fix in the end (including the re-pressurizing of the DRC something like $800 total) but I didn’t really want to move to coilovers if I could help it. A couple CV boots were done as well I believe.

I had given the car to my old buddy to store it for a while at his home, as I was leaving the country and they couldn’t start working on it for a couple weeks. I gave him permission to drive the car for about a week as well (I need to buy insurance on it each time I want to drive it outside of Russia) and long story short I probably won’t be doing that again. While I trust him to perfectly warm up the car before he starts beating on it, putting nearly 1000 miles on it was taking the p!ss if you ask me. I also heard some stories (directly from him to be fair) of how stable my car feels compared to his taking a slight bend in the highway at 170 mph. Okay. Lesson learned.

After collecting the car we drove it to Switzerland and back, and it was pretty flawless. Exhaust is bothersome on long trips but other than that it was good fun. It feels quick, too. Once every thousand miles or so I still get the CEL for implausible signal from one of the flap position sensors. I had asked for that to be fixed but it wasn’t and I needed the car. Still, turning it off and on clears it and then it takes ages to occur again so next time around maybe. The shifts have definitely improved and going into first gear from a stop is much easier now. It’s not perfect but maybe I’m too sensitive. My buddy kept going on about how smooth my gearbox is compared to his so what do I know.

I hope to do another Nurburgring trackday early '17 but after that I’m not sure the car will stay in Europe as I use it so very little. When I do visit Europe for something specific it often doesn’t make sense to use the RS4 as it costs too much time to drive over and I spend way more on 6$/gallon fuel than it costs me to fly over and rent a car. I do enjoy having it available there but for using it only 3 weeks a year it seems a bit of a waste.

Oh, and I had H&R lowering springs fitted on the fronts only. Always annoyed with how high it sat relative to the rear on the SS+ suspension, that’s sorted now. This pic was right after fitting, not sure if it will settle any lower after a bit of use but this is about perfect for me. May consider using wheel spacers, I have them lying around but for doing silly things on track with sticky tires I like the peace of mind of not running spacers for some reason.
Here’s a pic of it as it sits now, next to my friend’s B7 on 20 inch wheels and spacers.

http://www.greenringer.net/various/rs4s.jpg

who makes that flywheel?

also, i had the implausible flap signal code for the longest time on my car. ended up being the intake manifold flap solenoids. cheap fix at something like $90 for the replacement solenoid.

[JCviggen]

Hi JCViggen…I used to be a Volvo guy ( T5-R and R ) so I remember you from the Volvo forums . I guess we both migrated to Audi’s eventually owning both Rs6 and Rs4’s . I’m still amazed that your T5-R almost went flat 8 at the Nordschliefe ! and I also just saw your Misano on Boris’ Youtube video…very cool indeed ! you know the Ring quite well man . Props ! I’m planning on being there mid Spring for a few laps.

Do you by any chance remember a guy named Florian ? he had a green 850 T5-R estate, 5spd, caged, very fast around a track as well ?

Hi Mike!

Yes I do miss the old T-5R, should have held on to it, but it wasn’t convenient.

I do know Florian, in fact he’s a good friend of mine. He is also the one who currently owns the shell of my old T-5R and its engine! He is still rebuilding it, maybe this will be the year that it is finally ready. It has some of the components of his old 855, but with a new DMSB approved roll cage and the car has been stripped as bare as it could get and re-painted from scratch. Last time I saw it, it was white. Wiring is in the final stages, it now has a GTX3071R turbo and a Link ECU.

Small world

[JCviggen]

who makes that flywheel?

also, i had the implausible flap signal code for the longest time on my car. ended up being the intake manifold flap solenoids. cheap fix at something like $90 for the replacement solenoid.

TTV racing in the UK. If you go to ebay.co.uk and search for RS4 flywheel it’ll pop up. I dealt with them directly and saved a bit of money in the process.

Are the solenoids easily accessed? I’m thinking of getting the JHM tune option to delete the manifold flaps, apparently they should keep working just fine but gets rid of the codes. Down the line I could then remove them altogether.

Would be a good opportunity to ask them if they could please delete the launch control feature from my map, too, as it’s not compatible with my car and preventing any kind of brisk take-off from first gear.

Drove the car to the Swiss/French alps after New Year, amazing fun on these snowy roads. Awesome car for this kind of thing.

http://www.greenringer.net/various/courchevel.jpg

http://www.greenringer.net/various/courchevel2.jpg

http://www.greenringer.net/various/mountain.jpg

[justincredible]

Great pics. The car looks great .

[JCviggen]

In Belgium before flying back, I used the opportunity of some reasonably long and empty roads to do some performance testing. The JHM map isn’t allowing for a manual launch without the LA cutting in so I had to do a slow start, and winter tires aren’t ideal for rolling resistance but the results were pretty good anyway.

-10 Hz GPS log-
0-60 MPH 5.56s (ouch)
1/4 mile 13.0s at 112.7 (114.8 over the imaginary line)

Screenshots in the video https://youtu.be/zO8biGk-XXI

Here’s another test I “accidentally” did…not even realizing I exceeded my winter tires’ maximum speed rating by 7 or 8 MPH for a few seconds.

http://www.greenringer.net/various/150.jpg

Any idea how decent this 100-150 is? Hard to find any cars to compare to. Felt pretty brisk above 120.

[justincredible]

Nice video good shifts. The car looked very strong sounded great

[sakimano]

No idea I don’t know anyone who has tested 100-150

You can manually launch the car. Launching from an rpm that is above the launch assist trigger doesn’t really help anyway. You’re best launching from mid to high 3000s in my experience. 3700-3800 rpm, no slip just drop it.

I’ve done that a number of times. Stock clutch. Now at 148,000 kms.

Slipping it is where people roast their clutch. Same goes for changing gears, if you slip it on shifts you have problems.

Launch like you shifted and you’ll be fine.

That brought me 1.7-1.8 60 foot times.

A friend with your modlist routinely had mid to low 1.7 60 foot times.

A 1.7 60 foot time in that first video would mean a 12.2@112 1/4 mile time. Of course you also went 20 feet downhill so don’t garner too much from that in comparison to times at flat dragstrips.

[JCviggen]

You can manually launch the car.

Yes I can, but even if I launch it at 3000RPM the LC will cut in after the actual launch when I get to 5500 in 1st gear. It will stay there for half a second or so and then it continues. This happens on any kind of quick-ish launch, the only way to avoid it is go really slow like in the video.

I don’t need JHM to troubleshoot it, I’m fine if they just remove the LA from the tune when I flash to one that removes the SAI and intake flaps.

A 1.7 60 foot time in that first video would mean a 12.2@112 1/4 mile time. Of course you also went 20 feet downhill so don’t garner too much from that in comparison to times at flat dragstrips.

If you pause the YT video the vboxverify shot of the 1/4 mile run is there - the road for that run was flat until about 100 MPH and then sloped off a few feet for a total decline of -0.37%. Not going to make a real difference.

A friend of mine (the daytona B7 I posted a picture of) fitted a new engine to his MRC tuned RS4 and did 100-200 km/h in 9.2 seconds on his Pbox at 2 degrees C and 0.2 slope. Best I could manage was about 9.8 seconds but on winter tires. I could see 9.5 being possible had I still been on summer tires like him, but to catch up I’d probably need to get a carbon clean.

I did find a few 100-150 times:

Z4M : 21.5s, (C&D, June’06), 330HP, 3300lb

2009 GT-R : 16.2s, (C&D, Aug’08), 480HP, 3900lb

2011 GT500 :14.5s, (C&D, Aug’10), 550HP, 3800lb

C6 LS3 Z51 : 14.3s, (C&D, Sep’07), 436HP, 3300lb

E63 AMG : 13.9s, (C&D, Dec’09), 518HP, 4200lb

Jaguar XFR : 13.4s, (C&D, Dec’09), 510HP, 4400lb

2012 Carrera S:13.1s, (C&D, Feb 2012), 400HP, 3265lb

E60 M5 6spd manual : 13.1s, (C&D, Feb’07), 500HP, 4200lb

CTS-V : 12.8s, (C&D, Dec’09), 556HP, 4300lb

Panamera Turbo : 12.2s, (C&D, Apr’10), 500HP, 4300lb

E60 M5 SMG : 11.3s, (C&D, Jan '06), 500HP, 4200lb

2013 GT-R: 10.6s, (C&D, Feb 2012), 545HP, 3907lb

[vtgt]

The stock e60 smg is such a highway monster considering the weight. That gearing and the v10 is still rather impressive especially when compared to the 6 speed!

[JCviggen]

CountVohn, thank you for the PM, unfortunately the board doesn’t give me access to it.

I’ll be hitting up JHM for the revised tune a short time before I’ll use the car again, which will be early May for a trackday

[sakimano]

You can manually launch the car.

Yes I can, but even if I launch it at 3000RPM the LC will cut in after the actual launch when I get to 5500 in 1st gear. It will stay there for half a second or so and then it continues. This happens on any kind of quick-ish launch, the only way to avoid it is go really slow like in the video.

I don’t need JHM to troubleshoot it, I’m fine if they just remove the LA from the tune when I flash to one that removes the SAI and intake flaps.

weird, I’ve never heard of that. It was designed to only kick in wiht that 5500 RPM trigger from a stop so that you could still launch it manually if you wanted (anyone who wants to launch above 5500 RPM might be a little bit crazy)

as for MRC tuned RS4s, race him head to head. You’ll trounce him. I can’t explain the data re: him being supposedly faster, but my experience with MRC all motor RS4s is they’re just frankly not that fast. 100-150 or 62-124 testing is predominantly high RPM testing so I can see how a carbon clean would help. Reality though is that the area where carbon actually hurts is an area where we don’t spend much time in our typical acceleration efforts.

[sakimano]

if everyone gives JCViggen positive member rating he’ll be above zero and able to access PMs. I just did. Lots of good info in the thread that is worth it

[clochner]

+1 here

[jc_io]

Shifting and engine superb 🖒♭

[JCviggen]

if everyone gives JCViggen positive member rating he’ll be above zero and able to access PMs. I just did. Lots of good info in the thread that is worth it

Thank you!

I’m starting to find out that having the RS4 in Europe isn’t as straight forward as I thought it would be. Whenever I fly in, I kind of want to use it. That means if there is a problem or maintenance needs to be done the only opportune time is while I am away. The paperwork required to legally let my father drive a car on Russian plates in Belgium is a right old hassle. Then it needs to be stored in a garage of some relatives but they live an hour’s drive away, and my mother isn’t a big fan of driving on the highway (she’d need to drive the other car that will get them both back home)

The car is quite all right on the whole now, only the intermittent implausible signal from the flap position sensor on bank 1. But I’ve booked another Nurburgring trackday for May 2nd, 600 bucks worth, and I won’t get back to Belgium until 2 days before. I intend to flash the car with a new JHM map, and hope it works because if any issue there isn’t much time to revive the car in time. I’m not 100 percent on whether my brake pads have enough left either. All bloody annoying things to think about while I’m 2000 miles away.

On May 1st (a bank holiday in much of Europe) I’ll have to find someone to change the oil and filter, flash the new map in, do a brake fuild flush, possibly a set of pads, get the Michelin Cup tires on again and get to the Ring by 6 PM for registration and safety briefing. I guess it worked out last year, by the skin of my teeth, but the next one isn’t looking to be any easier.

[jpw12]

Nice time 100-200 km I know some guys over here that are low to mid 9 , they go toe to toe with flashed c63 amg …

[OzcarMeyer]

+1. Definitely enjoy this thread, and lot’s of information as well! Excited to see how you do at the nordschleife!

[Mistro]

You can manually launch the car.

Yes I can, but even if I launch it at 3000RPM the LC will cut in after the actual launch when I get to 5500 in 1st gear. It will stay there for half a second or so and then it continues. This happens on any kind of quick-ish launch, the only way to avoid it is go really slow like in the video.

I don’t need JHM to troubleshoot it, I’m fine if they just remove the LA from the tune when I flash to one that removes the SAI and intake flaps.

weird, I’ve never heard of that. It was designed to only kick in wiht that 5500 RPM trigger from a stop so that you could still launch it manually if you wanted (anyone who wants to launch above 5500 RPM might be a little bit crazy)

Yeah that does sound weird. I’ve launched mine lots of times manually and have never had that problem.

[JCviggen]

I found an Australian guy once who had the same problem. It appears that, somehow, there may be a slight difference in non-US cars that makes a difference to how the LA works.

If I try to use it as prescribed (clutch in, full throttle, ESP off) it will initially work like it should, holding revs somewhere above 5K. It will even launch just fine when I drop the clutch, but then a moment later as the rpm’s in first gear cross the point where the LA wanted to hold the revs with the clutch in, it will stay there for half a second or so and then continue the pull. Issues with stuff like clutch switches have already been ruled out, the car just seems confused but “realizes” very quickly after wrongly getting into the LA mode in first gear that it shouldn’t be and carries on. But the hesitation is just enough to ruin the time. If it really thought that the clutch was in or the car was stationary then it would stay at launch revs and not continue accelerating almost immediately after cutting in.

JHM had heard of the issue before when I asked them about it like 2 years ago or whenever I got the tune, but never heard back of any fix being available. A follow-up email I sent afterwards to Jake went unreplied. It’s no big deal really, I don’t do drag racing and I’d be able to launch my car to a reasonable standard myself if I want to do it once in a blue moon.

I realize the issue is too difficult/impractical to troubleshoot for JHM as the issue does not appear to have ever presented itself a US car. I’m happy to just have it removed from the map at a practical moment in time, such as when I order a revised tune with the SAI and flaps deleted.

[quote]Nice time 100-200 km I know some guys over here that are low to mid 9 , they go toe to toe with flashed c63 amg …
[/quote]
Simply putting my Michelin Cup 2’s back on would probably be enough for a mid-9 too, lower than that I need more mods or a good cleaning I’m guessing. I’m still running the same OEM air filter that was in it when I bought the car more than 2 years ago, too. Have had a cold air feed lying around for ages but never got round to getting the passenger side aux rad removed.

PS: Thanks to all for getting my editing and PM rights restored