Hey JCViggen - Do you have the part number for that steering wheel piece? I need that as well.
That’s a good idea. People generally notice if there are bugs or issues with there cars after the jhm tune. From what I have seen it’s sensitive to all the inputs more so than stock. They have said the lower the trigger points for codes apposed to other companies raising the limits or turning them off. I would try a good throttle body adaption and check the long term fuel trims.
Did a TB adaption and went for a short drive with a bit of full throttle here and there. Too early to tell if the idle issue is gone or not. But first impressions is that it may have improved considerably. A warm daytime test with the AC providing a higher load will be more useful.
I tried a launch with the “launch assist” the day I flashed the car and I tried one today - neither worked very well. Don’t want to ruin the clutch just tried it to see what it did. It actually works as advertised and gets you off the line really well but then it does a massive bog in first gear some time after the actual launch. It literally gets off the throttle for some reason (most certainly no wheelspin at that point) and slows things down by 0.3-0.4 seconds if I had to guess.
The log shows the hesitation is caused by the throttle so the ECU told it to close and then open again.
http://www.greenringer.net/various/LA.jpg
Also appears that the JHM rev limit is at least slightly higher than stock. I never managed 8160 RPM without hitting the limiter before, it always cut in somewhere between 8000 and 8050 RPM. (Which corresponds to 8250 on the tach)
This log also surprised me a little in terms of IAT. When I was idling at the beginning it was showing 50C which then steadily dropped as I got going. Seemed a much bigger delta over ambient than what I remember from before. I wonder if the airbox flap isn’t closing properly. After a bit of driving and full throttle I saw 12-13C over ambient in the log as lowest values. From memory my log in winter stayed a lot closer to ambient when going slowly in particular.
When you did your launch did you disable the ESP?
Should look like this…what you described sounds like ESP stepping in.
Any chance you forgot to turn it off?
Audi RS4 4.2 FSI 0-60 mph 4.1s JHM Launch Assist:
Yes ESP fully off. I’m not even sure the LA would work if I left it on? The instructions have it fully off so it was fully off (solid light on the dash)
Also the ESP would kick in right when you let go of the clutch and you actually create a little wheelspin. But the throttle stayed open nicely only to close much later when there wasn’t a hint of wheelspin.
Guess I’ll ask JHM.
The data looks like the jhm tune is trying to protect your car from something. The timing pull and the reduced throttle placement that’s vintage protection stuff. There might still be some bugs hiding in your car. From the idle issue that seemed to be fixed with the adaption to this. The nice thing about the jhm tune is so many people have it. So you start to know how it works and what to expect.
Also you can’t sit on the LA for long. It doesn’t work as well. You basically want to press clutch in, mash the gas and as soon as the RPMs get up, drop the clutch.
LA was fucking amazing on my S4, my 60’ times were usually within a few hundredths 1.78-1.81
Tire pressure and grip will also effect the launch of bogging. You almost need just enough wheel spin…not too much, but you still want a little.
Small and temporary timing pulls on a per cylinder basis are pretty normal I think. It’s not removing 7 or 8 degrees, you see this kind of stuff on the stock map which runs slightly less to begin with.
Also, I can do first gear starts full throttle all day long without any of this weird bogging as long as I don’t use the LA. The ECU doesn’t request anything different timing or fuel wise when doing a normal manual start. So there must be a connection with the LA.
Where do you start to troubleshoot when logged MAF, fuel pressure, O2 sensors, timing etc are all normal? No error codes of any kind either. There is nothing to go on…
[quote]Also you can’t sit on the LA for long. It doesn’t work as well. You basically want to press clutch in, mash the gas and as soon as the RPMs get up, drop the clutch.
[/quote]
Had read something along those lines before yes, so that’s what I did. The log shows about 0.6 seconds between reaching revs and taking off. http://youtu.be/4tcyAl6f8jY
My car creates very little wheelspin. Pretty much nothing really. But that’s not something I can control while using the LA obviously. The PSS are pretty grippy.
Small timing pull can be normal in certian ranges but add timing pull with throttle shut and that’s clearly pointing to the ecu stepping back the power for a reason
You can control wheel spin by way of tire pressure or the type of road you are launching on.
You also haven’t measured anything related so you thinking the car is bogging, may actually be the LA doing what it’s suppose to do.
It still works with Esp on
Considering the fact that I see the same timing pull everywhere without the throttle being closed would suggest otherwise. I can go full throttle all day long and the ECU is happy to keep the throttle open and run 30+ timing even on the cylinder being reduced the most.
http://www.greenringer.net/various/log1.jpg
http://www.greenringer.net/various/log2.jpg
It ONLY does the weird thing with LA active, so it’s reasonable to conclude that it is related.
[quote]You also haven’t measured anything related so you thinking the car is bogging, may actually be the LA doing what it’s suppose to do.
[/quote]
Well I know it is. I can feel it and I can see in the log it closed the throttle at a point where traction was already not an issue. I don’t think it’s working as designed if it’s slower than what I would do on a cautious manual start.
Honestly though I don’t care about LA. I wouldn’t pay for the feature if it was optional because I don’t need it. I just wanted to note that it’s not working very well on my car so far.
I’ve not seen any more strange weaving of the idle RPMs, there are no error codes and the logs look normal. If anyone has some idea of where to start the troubleshooting I’m all ears.
Well its clear your not the sharpest tool in the shed. Let me post it again…I just said before you even posted the log that some timing pull can be normal in certian ranges. And then you posted a log of just what I was talking about. Let me repost what I said.
A ECU event is when a string of things happen. Your car can pull timing in a wide range of events. However on your one posted log the throttle closes and pulls timing for a small spot. When this happens together at the same time when you dont see timing pull for a long range of rpm before is called an event. When there isn’t any timing pull for several thousand rpm and at the same time as the throttle shutting you get timing pull that’s generally what’s going to happen when the ecu is pulling power.
So in many situations there can be timing pull and one could say that’s a partial event. When you add limp mode like throttle shut in conjunction with timing pull that is part of helping find a conclusion. From the first page of this thread your car has not run right. And you have had issues. There are hundreds and hundreds of rs4 owners that have the jhm tune and there cars run flawlessly and are setting platform records. You can’t seem to get a clean launch with the LA feature. I’m just trying to help you sort through whatever is happening.
From your above comments I don’t know if you thought I was saying that timing pull will mean throttle shut but that’s not the case. Just saying you have an event happening that excludes two things that might be a good spot to work from
The logs I posted were meant to illustrate that the timing pulls happen anyway. In fact they will happen on just about every car out there. Certainly with 1 or 2 degrees extra requested from a tune. I’d like to see a log of a tuned car that has no small timing adjustments at all during a full throttle run. The ECU will always adapt to run the most timing it can get away with. That means pushing it until some cylinders need to be dialed back slightly. It’s simply working as designed.
So I don’t see why you think the timing pull and throttle valve getting closed are necessarily connected. In fact there appears to be no obvious connection. There was no short “event”. It only appears short because it was in first gear and there’s only a few data points before it runs out.
If there was an actual mechanical issue causing the throttle “protection” to kick in should not only happen with LA active. And closing the throttle is pretty much a last resort feature, if something severe enough was happening to warrant this happening there should be an error code and limp mode. As the car carries on like nothing happened 3 tenths of a second later, this does not appear to be the case. It feels like the ESP kicking in except that it’s off.
Not going to argue about a feature I don’t need. The car runs well otherwise, feels good, no complaints. I can’t actually tell from the seat of my pants that it’s tuned but that’s simply a feature of tuning an NA car that was pretty maxed out from the factory. I wasn’t expecting anything else. I’ll need a JHM exhaust to get any more out of it. Still looking at how to make that happen logistically.
Performance wise I would say the car has run right from the start, don’t see how you got a different impression. It was quick on the stock map from the moment I bought it. It’s too warm right now for a better comparison unfortunately.
I’m off to Crete tomorrow, with some luck it will be cooler outside when I get back.
It’s no secret your not very bright. Funny how your car has all these issues but your so smart and everyone else that seems to know very little has great running cars. Good luck apparently you need it. And i know reading might not be your strong point but try reading the first pages of your thread to see how your car hasn’t run right since you got it. But it’s becoming more and more clear why.
Any way I can say I helped.
[quote] If anyone has some idea of where to start the troubleshooting I’m all ears
[/quote]
Seriously…
Jcviggen… You’re a guy in Russia who knows a little.
You are arguing with a guy in America who is best friends with the guy who wrote your frigging tune.
Maybe shut the fuck up and listen. He knows more than you.
This looks like the same issue I had when I tried the launch control feature.
It appears to be something with oversea ecu codes or something as its not an issue with the USA models.
There was another guy from Aus that had the same issue and was working with JHM to sort out. Last I heard he had a new revision to try and was providing some logs.
I don’t know how he got on.
Link to my thread.
http://audirevolution.net/forum/index.php?topic=2702.0