Since we have seen the launch of the first of 4 TVSr1740 APR supercharger kits (B7 RS4 launched, B8 S4, B8 RS5, R8 still waiting) and we have some pricing information, what do you think the B8 S4 kit will cost?
We did this a while ago, but I don’t think anyone expected the RS4 kit price to be what it was.
So, knowing what we now know, how much do you think the B8 S4 kit will cost?
B7 RS4 APR TVSr1740 kit $17,750
Upgraded fuel pumps $1200 for yours rebuilt or $1800 for new ones = $1200 to 1800
Fluids = $225
It’s going to be pricey but the interesting thing to me is going to be price to performance. I have a sneaking suspicion this 1740 kit just isn’t going to make bucketloads more power than the 1320 ST2 on 91/93 straight pump gas, which is what 98% of us are going to drive around on.
I believe this because I looked at the compressor maps of the R1320 and R1900 on Eaton’s site and, taking the R1320’s max airflow and plotting it against the R1900’s map at high PR it was only about 7% difference in efficiency. That means the output temp and parasitic HP just aren’t going to be much different. So unless the heat exchangers, TB inlet or something else is dramatically better, it’s probably just not going to see big HP boosting to the level a St2 1320 can hit now (~18psi?) on 91/93.
Maybe 40 more AWHP at same octane and nearly the same boost? I’d also be interested in if it makes a bit more power at higher rpm like 7100 vs the 6400 or so the DSG shifts at.
Not hating either. I hope I’m mistaken and it’s gangbusters HP but I just can’t see it given what I know ATM.
[quote=“boosteasy,post:2,topic:5100”]
10-12 cars shift at 7K already… It’s only the 13+'s that shift lower in the rpm range because of the gearing change, which is why they are slower…
Saki, I voted 10K or so… I guess this because there will be less required, fuel rails, fuel pump, injectors, etc. Also, I think APR realizes they will see 5x or more of these than they will for the RS4 and probably RS5/R8’s as well so they will be able to spread the R&D expense over more units… Finally, I don’t think the gains will be as large so they won’t be able to justify too high of a price… Just my .02
I won’t setup a poll but for anyone who replies what are the guesses on when it will be available for our cars? I say Spring 2014 it will be released…
Winter 2014
Spring 2014
Summer 2014
Fall 2014
Later
I voted $12,000 personally but I think even that’s low.
The RS4 needs only the fuel pumps upgraded, but injectors are fine I believe. Injectors are expensive. Will the B8 S4 injectors be fine? probably. How about the fuel pumps? I have no idea. I wouldn’t be shocked if you needed fuel pumps but if you don’t that’s only $1200-1800 saved. Couple grand with some fuel lines. But I don’t see a huge difference in the fuelling costs from RS4 to S4.
Cooling I guess it could add up to around $2000-3000 or so. Then what? We’re at maybe $5,000 (retail) in savings. That leaves me at $14,000. And cooling (B8 S4 OEM) has to be redesigned and upgraded. You will need CPS. CPS isn’t free, so don’t forget that. Just because you’ve already purchased it, doesn’t mean it’s not part of the cost of the kit. So we’re back to $17,000 ($2000 from the RS4 kit thanks to fuelling savings). What else is there to be saved vs. the RS4? Maybe $2000 somewhere? $3000? So maybe $12,000-14,000 is more realistic.
Someone floated that idea a while back that you just pulll the 1320 and pop the 1740 in, and bob’s your uncle. I think you need an entirely new manifold. So the supercharger, which is being sold to you from the OEM then to a middleman (APR) is going to be a big nickel. Can’t escape that. Then the cooling upgrade. Then the cost of design and tooling and manufacture of the plenum…I think it’s going to be pretty expensive even for the 3.0T guys.
I think 10k is a pipe dream…no offense prime. Do you guys think the current upgraded CPS will be sufficient for the new charger?
I don’t know truthfully and it doesn’t affect me much, but I think APR will still have a pretty high price tag on the B8 S4 kit. Only a few thousand less than the RS4 kit. I guess current customers with software and CPS will save a little more than the rest, but I bet from stock to Stage 3 TVS1740 it will be damn near close to the RS4 price or $17.5+, which I voted for.
B8 S4 = $15,000 (later dropping to $12,000 after they sell several dozen)
I’m talking for a bone stock B8 S4. APR may position it as $12,750 without CPS to make the price look lower than it is, as they did with the fuel pumps on the RS4 kit (I think that’s being a bit embarrassed about the price really)…,but that really means $12,750 + $2000 which will mean as near as makes no difference, $15,000 for a B8 S4.
I don’t believe APR discounts software on these stage 3 kits even though you’re an existing customer of stage 1-2…at least they didn’t on the B8 A4 K04 kit.
Like boost easy mentioned though, I’m really interested in the upgrade being worth it at all. I’m thinking a lot of B8 guys that get in the line will be expecting pump gas RS4 times…Maybe they will nip some heels on race gas, but I don’t know :o
In my book that is a lot of money to spend for a half second or so.
Maybe someone will develop a Centrifugal system upgrade or find some of the 3.0T limits.
That doesn’t make much sense to me, those customers will be some of the first in line. Once your JHM tuned…your basically good for most everything they offer (nitrous, supercharger upgrade). That is the B6/7 S4 stuff though, I’m sure not much changes on the RS4 side though.
Then again, APR charges for A,B,C tune on one ECU if you want different octane and what not. I guess companies just do what works and makes money.
Not sure. I don’t know. They should though. If they charged someone $1500 for a stage 1 tune and $500 for a pulley, I reckon they should help the guy out if possible. Maybe knock $500 off. As a thank you.
Guys, Good points… My 10k guess is without cps… I’m also assuming someone who I already tuned as well… I should have mentioned those things as well. I’ll admit I’m an optimist so you’re probably right… I’m in either way as long as it happens soon… Maybe I’ll stage III the S and TT at the same time and they’ll give me a discount… Lol
I’ve chosen the 10k option as well. I would like to think that APR and or it’s partner(s) in development of this are maximizing current hardware. The majority of parts that you get with the RS4 kit are already on the S4.
One the same line of thinking if the power gained is not great I’d think there would no extra need for upgraded fueling components.
They’re getting 650chp out of the 1740 on the RS4 id expect to see the same results for the S4
What do you think the odds are something is done for a Stg III and a Stg III+. That being the lower version possibly using a lower boost profile, stock fuel pump and stock cooling system (personally don’t know just how good or how bad cooler system is on the car).
Just thinking APR knows for the S4 people are more likely to want to mod over time to break the cost up. Just like most people probably do tune then tune+pulley rather than just the combo off the bat.
Basically thinking for the S4, it may make even more sense than on the RS4 for have 2 main release versions. Sell the kits on the end build opportunity, but have a basic stg 3 that really isn’t much more than a tune+pulley performance.
This is all dependent of course that the S4’s delta power gain is enough to allow for that. Some obviously have already questioned how much of a gain there really is to be had.
