Teaser: APR 3.0 TFSI Stage III Supercharger System

B8 S4
#81

Cheers to that. I hope MAFs die out fast industry-wide, it’s such a liability considering how unreliable they are.

So I’m assuming the anti-tuning encryption is there too? That would pretty much kill the 3.2 blower swap idea unless APR or GIAC (or ASP I guess) picks up the ball, or until ECU tools are released for getting around it. Although I do see Uni offering OBDII port flashing for the 3.2FSI…http://www.unitronic-chipped.com/ecu-tuning/Audi-A5-B8-32L-FSI-V6-2008. PES too…hmmmm?

the 12.5 compression ratio would make it interesting. I can’t see this running as anything more than stage I boost of 13 psig…but still, would be pretty neat.

#82

Questions for Arin:

  • Have you blown any 3.0t’s yet?
  • Have you found the DSG/mechatronics to be reliable with the stage 3 kit?
  • What clutch/design are you using for the 6MT cars?
  • Do you own any fish or RC cars?

Thanks!

#83

lol win

#84

The RS4 is Bosch. What supplier gets the deal is not primarly a thing of using a maf sensor or not but who makes the better overall offer to the OEM.Though a P/N system is much cheaper and more robust, it’s a much bigger PIA to get to the same quality level as a maf sensor system.

#85

Yes I know the RS4 is Bosch and I was simply pointing out what I saw. They could be hiding parts in the air box like with the V10s but I haven’t had time to look under the hood of a RS5 with my own eyes yet. In my experience with Audi the two companies (Bosch and Siemens) use the systems as I said earlier. Bosch also sells maf sensors so it helps to push the parts that you sell with the programming that you offer. The speed density system works and more tuners, even probably at the OEM level too, are more comfortable with it which lowers the price down. Hell didn’t Honda keep using speed density until like 2002 or 2003. Just seems like they are going backwards since in 1996 most OEMs went to a maf system (and sequential fuel injection over bank firing) to help with meeting OB2 emissions which are only getting tougher to meet by each new year.

#86

Good question about the market.

JHM was digging around some of the old Audis and bought an old B6 A4 3.0 to see if any of their 4.2 stuff applied. A lot of the principals behind improving the 4.2 applied to the 3.0, so they kind of put the feelers out and created a tune, exhaust solution. They were overwhelmed with the response…maybe to their detriment.

The backlog got huge, and right in the middle of it, they changed their exhaust manufacturing and their tuning delivery system. So now there are a ton of cock-teased 3.0 guys just waiting on JHM to get some shit to them.

So I think the 3.2 market would really surprise you. 3.2 B7 A4 Avant (if such an animal existed) with a TVSr1320 would be really cool.

[quote=jspazz]and nobody will spend what will likely approach $8000 on this system from APR
[/quote]
you’re nuts if you think that.

PES sells $10,000 Eaton M90 kits for the B6/7 S4, the RS4 and the S5…even though it gives the cars basically enough air to make 450 crank hp, and run 12.6 @ 110…a.k.a. just about what a stock RS4 does…or within a tenth or two of what a B6 can do with $4000 in mods. Yet they still sell…well.

PES also sells $8,000 superchargers for the V6 A4 guys…even though the first generation were so badly tuned they blew multiple motors and basically destroyed any shred of a reputation PES may have had.

APR sold the TVSr1320 kits for the RS4 for $19,000 when they launched a few years back. Guys couldn’t get them quick enough. They eventually ‘lowered’ the price to $15,000.

Eurocode sells headers to B8 S4 owners that are good for maybe 10-20 hp at the crank and provide barely discernable performance gains. They are nearly $3000, and cost nearly $1500 to install. Yet there are a dozen guys running around the forums with them.

There is always a market. Further, your $8000 estimate for the APR TVSr1320 3.0 to 3.2 conversion kit is likely a bit low…and will still sell. Just might take too long and too much hassle to develop, and they likely don’t want to sell used stuff since a beat on supercharger may not have the same life left as a fresh unit.

#87

I see B7 A4 3.2 avants, saki… They are 15-20k US, I didn’t look in Canada. A lot more B8 3.2 FSI avants.

I’m not nuts…$8K for a kit with a USED supercharger is a bit to spend on a car only worth $15K, and I don’t think the market is there at that cost. The cars you mention are all newer, or in the hands of the original owners, plus were “performance” models that are typically owned by enthusiasts. 3.2 FSI avant is hardly an enthusiasts car. Hell, nobody’s ever convinced you to do anything to your car…yet. If you don’t believe it enough, I doubt you’re truly convinced yourself.

#88

Yeah you are just underestimating the value of Audi tax.

Also I’ve got news for you… The b8 s4 is, in audis words, not a performance model… It’s the upgraded engine a4…which is what the a4 3.2 used to be. Again, you underestimate whose hands they are in.

Further arguing that because the car is only worth $15k people won’t put $8,000 I to it is obtuse. You yourself have a $5,000 Allroad in your garage that will need about $8,000 in mods to go stage three…(turbos, intercoolers, downpipes, cat back, fuelling, tuning) and people do that every single day on the forums. And it will barely match (if you’re lucky) the performance of a 3.2 with the 1320. There are b6 a4 3.0 guys on this little forum who have $600tunes, $1300 catbacks, $600 downpipes, $2000 lightweight wheels etc etc that’s $4000-bucks… and they’re miles from a tvs 1320 3.2. They’re also putting that money into a car worth 1/3 as much.

So I don’t get your skepticism (about your own idea lol)

You need to get out of the b8 forum once in a while. There are 3.2 a4 guys with $10,000 in mods in the cars. Go post a thread in the b7 a4 forum on audizine to see if they would be interested in an APR tuned and designed tvsr1320 kit pulled from b8 s4 cars. They are performance starved… And you will be surprised at the responses I’m sure.

While you’re in there, don’t forget to tell them that their cars aren’t enthusiasts cars. You will get fucking destroyed.

#89

I didn’t say whether its the right or wrong thing to do, but I’m saying its the way the market works. People might end up spending that much in the end on an older car, but they always do it in bits and pieces, not by dropping a whack of cash on an old car all in one go…

I added it up, yeah I try not to think about how much parts I’ve collected for the allroad over the years, but $7K pretty much covers everything I’ve already bought, (PSS9 conversion, new K04s, fueling, engine overhaul parts) plus the magnaflow and the JHM intercooler I’ll pick up. In some ways you’re right, but I wouldn’t have done it if I had to plunk down $8K all at once for just the motor. Hey, what’s your excuse? Are you going to do anything to yor car? Maybe you should stage III the avant…hmmmmm

#90

That’s what I mean… Just because you did it in drips and drabs doesn’t mean everyone does. Plenty of people spend a whack. On these cars. Just worry about your nine cars and don’t worry about mine lol. I’m

Tell me… Why has pes sold a bunch of superchargers for the 3.0 guys at this price you say is so out of whack? And that kit contained a shitty fifth gen m62

Actually don’t worry about it. Agree to disagree. Until you post what I said to in audizine b7a4 I am not interested. You just seem bent on an argument. Fir you suggested this and I said it was a cool idea. Then you thought I was against the idea (despite me supporting the idea). Then you started arguing against the idea…your own idea mind you…Once I made it clear I was inside with it and thought that it would be a good business idea for Apr to look it. Sorry… Find another target.

#91

Saki, Not sure why youre so sensitive…i was directing my statement to Arin…you called me nuts. The only thing I think won’t work is a $8-10K APR offering. Read my posts!

And yes I’m still curious when/how you’re going to modify your car. Not maliciously…I am genuinely curious!

J

Edit: are you genuinely in the market for a supercharger? If so, would it be the JHM centrifugal, or a future APR TVS?

#92

I am happy with my car right now. When I need to modify it I will see what is out there however I would give the jhm stuff a good long hard look. They served me well on my s4.

The jhm cfuge is going to do well. For a cheap option it will blow people’s minds.

#93

Who needs major modz when Mistro’s car with piggies and no tune went as fast as auditurds Revo B8 or jspazz’s Apr S2 on pump gas :wink:

Plus aren’t you CPO, saki? Worth not modding to keep that on the straight and level IMO.

#94

exactly… But those facts make you a hater. Be careful, or you will next be asked to end this charade.

That’s a great point though. Would love to see those guys address that head on.

Stock RS4 = Stock B8 S4

Mistro RS4 + piggies (free diy) + intake spacers $200 + hpipe $200 = better trap speeds than various b8s4s with tune $1500 + pulley $500 + intake $500 etc.

Pretty funny.

Wonder where he ranks among the pump gas b8 s4 times…

Edit: just checked…out of the dozens of b8 s4 times, only five cars were faster trap speeds on pump gas (four really, and the last was within a tenth of an mph… Same track too) … than mistro trapped his rs4 with a $400 modlist lol.

FONZIE. 115.71
Richib86. 114.97
81bear. 114.81
Tins5. 114.36
Turbobaby. 113.80
Mistro. 113.70

#95

(newscast scene)

…and with that important newsflash about how cheap it is to make the B7 RS4 fast (and why it’s ok, since fonzie, Richi, Bear, tins5 and turbobaby are all still faster on pump), back to our regularly scheduled programming on the B8S4itis network:

The APR stage III supercharger upgrade…

BUT WAIT! … another important newsflash - even the new RS5 traps slower than mistros RS4, and - gasp - some are thinking that the RS5 APR stage I upgrade will help them - but it won’t! Someone better warn them about this fast RS4 driven heroically by the dashing young man…

(CUT to bedroom scene)

(Jspazz wakes up in a cold sweat, grabs the AudiRevolution 1/4 mile printout, and sees his 1/4 was indeed quicker than mistros…lets out a big fart, much to the annoyance of his wife, and laughs himself back to sleep)

ok lol I’ve had drinks and I’ll go to bed. I’ll see what sakibomb awaits me in the morning, maybe a lump of coal?

oh

The 3.2FSi supercharger swap seems like a dead end to me…it looks entirely possible with minor additional parts, and someone available to tune the Simos unit - there’s just not enough cars that appear interesting to me in a 3.2FSI. The majority of the 3.2s for sale are slushboxes, and I’m not a fan of the C6 (the bulk of the 3.2s). And - not many Avants available.

#96

LOL @ dashing young man. The fart is a sign - was it like the sound of an upshift in a DSG B8 LOLOLOL :smiley:

#97

[quote=“bangoman,post:96,topic:3983”]
LOL! Well played… Merry X-mas everyone…

#98

Hahahahah extra propulsion…

Merry Christmas to you too, and all in this thread…hopefully one day in 2013, we do indeed all get to meet up.

#99

Jspazz hates facts. He’s pretending he’s not infected.

I mentioned the costs because of the myriad of comments in the thread on az about how easy/cheap it is to mod the b8 and how the rs4 doesn’t respond to mods. Are you going to call me cheap again (pot calling kettle…the guy with no bumper on his m5 lol)?

See… Nowhere in that post was I addressing it to you Jspazz. Note where I said “those guys”…Not Jspazz. (your egocentrism is showing). Did you buy yourself some hristnas gifts and wrap then up?

#100

Ha! I’m too busy worrying about the fuel leak under the car to think about a new bumper…not to mention the driver’s window regulator, the A/C fan, broken nav, RR wheel speed sensor, etc, etc…it’ll get a new hose supplying the fuel filter in a week and that’ll be it…nobody called the SPC///M on me yet…:slight_smile:

Saki, seriously, I think you need mods, since you keep going to the drag strip… I would rather line up against you in a low-12/high 11 race. If it’s the JHM charger, so be it, but you gotta do something…it would just be more fun…or for a different experience…come with me next spring to the road course…in your car, it’s already got good brakes, it’ll be very very rewarding. Apex has a great program at Mosport and great instructors, and the “exotic car show” on the track is pretty crazy.