Hello.
I am considering getting the JHM tune for my 2008 S6. I have done a search here and there is quite a lot of positive opinions on the tune.
This tune will be going on a stock S6. I may later get the JHM exhaust.
Anything in particular I need to be aware of before I get the tune? Also, will the tune also reprogram the transmission shifting?
Thanks.
The TCU portion was noticeable to me at least, but I also did a trans flush prior that probably helped give a positive impression.
D seems untouched if I’m honest, it’s S where all the fun&magic happens. You have to really baby the throttle or you’ll get whiplash (seriously). I find myself going from D to S a lot during my drive if I’m honest. Mileage went up a little I think but now she’s way more sensitive to fuel grade. Zero problems running 93, but I’ll get varying levels of knock from 91 - apparently we’ve got really crappy 91 here in town.
I bought the cable and flashed it myself - I’m a computer nerd by profession and even I found the process a but complex, but doable. Overall pleased with the purchase.
I would recommend that you sort out any intake, ignition and injector issue first though; if not you’ll be chasing codes in an unproductive way like I did. I should’ve done the tune last honestly.
Thanks for the info. I’m pretty sure my car has all its issues sorted out. I performed a carbon clean and replaced the intake manifold within the first couple of weeks of getting the car along with several other maintenance items.
I would also flash the car myself. I have read the JHM instructions and it does seem to be a more complicated than normal flash procedure.
What I am curious about is how long it takes to flash the car. JHM specifies that the car needs to be put on a 40 AMP charger and that the computer needs to be connected to the internet preferably by a wired connection.
I live in an apartment so I would need to run a 100 ft ethernet cable and extension cord out to my car to do the flash.
It took me about 2 hours from connecting the charger to starting the car with the new tune. Not sure on the trans shifting, I don’t remember any significant change in shifting when i did mine.
You won’t get the full benefit from the tune for a day or two, so the power you feel right after you flash the car will get better as you drive.
Some good points raised here, my number one and probably only concern is about the sensitivity. I understand the tune has a lot more safety parameters meaning limp modes and codes are easier to trip.
I have struggled with limp modes and electrical gremlins - the car is still in the shop at the moment. Mines a daily driver and our family away wagon. So gaining performance but making it code and limp out more often is not what I need right now.
However every bit of research I have done says Jhm tune is the one to get, seat of the pants feel and 1/4mile times gains are in black and white. Their inlet spacers made a world of difference, I’d love a flywheel but need her reliable first.
I’ve kind of gone luke warm on quite a few of these mods. For example, after reading this in the Service Training manual, I passed on the JHM damper, which they curiously just refer to as a “crank pulley”:
“In addition to the elastomer rubber damping element, a special viscous oil is used. This oil dampens the relative
movement between the elastomer rubber element and the accessory drive pulley. This action not only reduces torsional stress placed on the crankshaft by the combustion process but also reduces stress to the crankshaft from accessory components driven by the poly-V belt.”
With all due respect to the folks at JHM, there’s no way a piece of solid machined aluminum is going to provide the Audi-designed damping. On what basis did they decide this functionality was no longer necessary, I don’t know. As it is a V10 configuration is inherently unbalanced, thus the need for a balance shaft.
Pros and cons there, the V10 does run a balance shaft which is literally designed to tackle balance factors - both primary and secondary balance factors.
The flywheel/crank pulley keeps inertia in the engine as its spinning. A very popular mods for motorcycle racers is to remove crank flywheel COMPLETELY. I have done this and then gone down the CARVE kilos off cranks also. We took a 25lb crank and flywheel assembly to around a 10lb assembly. The change was night and day - the willingness for the engine to rev was incredible. Down side is its weaker (crank was as we carved soo much off) and it was far harder to use the power. Hears the kicker…dyno results are 0…naaaddddaaa, you get essentially zero hp from it, its simply a response change. It also made it far hard to get off the line (bikes cant be auto and wheelie pretty easily compared to cars …)
That triple filled damper would defo make slower engine speed vibes lower, it would possible help with the super low end torque that the V10 makes - audi can probably run a more raunchy low RPM cam setting/profiling with this style of damper. If you use your S6 to tow etc the lower end will be better with the stock damper… The higher end rpms are where the balance shaft does the work. I.e my bike with the super light crank had more vibes at 4,000rpm than at 10,000rpm.
Everything is always a compromise - brakes and tyres are the perfect examples, better ones last less, they have to to work better at the higher level your asking of them.
From the reviews to the actual performance proven. The JHM tune is a great way to go and you won’t be disappointed.
The tune is adaptive so the better the octane the better the performance add is. The tune adapts over a few days as it picks up on your driving style and the fuel climate and over all ability of the motor to make more power.
When you flash make sure to clear your TCU. Some ECUs will clear and reset the TCU when flashing others you have to do it manually. The ECU tune makes the most of the allotted ability to make and support better transmission shifting. while JHM has an actual TCU flash for the S6 and S8 you need to be local to JHM or metro Detroit for one of the main dealers.
JHMs tune is hands down leaps and bounds better than ANYOTHER tune. Most people didn’t or don’t tune because the other more known APR tune was about shit and didn’t add any performance. It just gave you a hot pedal. The upside with the JHM tune is JHM And about 5 other customers went to the track to prove it makes not only better more exciting driving but more acceleration and power.
As for the crank pulley. It works as neil_cb125t said this isn’t new. The removal of rotational weight off the flywheel and crank help the motors ability to spin with less resistance. There is a hp and Tq gain but its not something you can easily measure. The best part is the JHM crank pulley really shines in transitional power. like your part or low throttle and your wanting to scoot though traffic. There is less load or chug on the motor with the reduced weight.
Why would you want to replace your stock dampener from your S6 or S8. Well the technical bulletin gives the same talking point about this part for the past 10 years and every OEM Audi dampener I have ever seen other than ones on cars that are practically brand new are broken… seized… or completely failed and falling apart.
The rubber cracks just like the other rubber hoses on the motor and the ability to actually dampen breaks just like the intake manifold flaps do. Several people think the front main is leaking when it turns out the dampener has been leaking out fluid and is now dry and just useless.
Even cars as new as 2015 3.0T S4s with the supercharged motor we seeing there dampeners actually ripping apart and falling off the car. http://audirevolution.net/forum/index.php?topic=3239.0
The OEM dampeners have had these issues since as long as I can remember. I replaced mine 8 years ago with the JHM unit and have had no issues. This isn’t just a 5.2 thing the list of guys who have done this is extensive. This isn’t just something that JHM tried on the S6 and S8. I’ll see if I can do a search and find the guys who did a oil test to see if there was any signs of extra ware with the JHM crank pulley over 5 years of use. They found no difference in ware but a pleasant bump in acceleration and response
Check out the actual results from across the board. JHM makes crank pulleys for
the
3.0T
RS4 - 4.2
S4 4.2
S6/S8 5.2
A4 2.0
RS7 4.0T
Really, I agree with 95% of what everyone is saying, and the other 5% I’m not sure any of us can be sure of.
There is no question there will be an improvement in performance. Less weight, less inertia. No one can argue with that. So, don’t misunderstand me, I’m not even going there.
The comparison with the racing world doesn’t matter because they do inspections and tear downs all of the time. Racers aren’t looking for durability over 200k miles. But, Justin running a JHM pulley for 8 years is good info, as is cars running with failed dampers.
In general, performance mods are sold to people to keep there cars for few years and then move on to another car. Who really knows what the long term effects are. An oil analysis won’t tell anything, as it is portrayed as a crank stress issue, although perhaps minor. Could be a case of German over-engineering, who knows.
Really, what it comes down to this question for me: has the JHM crank pulley been proven to minimize the vibration that Audi thought was problematic enough to use a more expensive damper? The manual talks about stress reduction on the crankshaft, and I’m not in the position to disagree, so for me personally it’s not worth it. I’ve done this dance in the Porsche world with mixed results, so I’m less enthusiastic now.
[quote]Really, what it comes down to this question for me: has the JHM crank pulley been proven to minimize the vibration that Audi thought was problematic enough to use a more expensive damper? The manual talks about stress reduction on the crankshaft, and I’m not in the position to disagree, so for me personally it’s not worth it. I’ve done this dance in the Porsche world with mixed results, so I’m less enthusiastic now.
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Well honestly, we’re not talking about a serpentine belt; there’s only one accessory that’s driven by belt… The LW Pulley from JHM is also counterbalanced at (I’m assuming), the correct point to offset the harmonics from the main counterbalance. I’ve done full LW pulleys on various cars for years and while the comment is correct that it adds zero to a dyno sheet, the effects on throttle response can sometimes be pretty dramatic. IMO, if you’re going to be replacing the tensioner and belt anyway, might as well replace the pulley while you’re there too. YMMV.
Having said that, I’m sure there’s way more seat of the pants feel benefit to going to lightweight wheels and brake rotors. Both of those will net 25-30lbs off of the unsprung weight of the car - which is well, huge.
Sorry it seems we have hi jacked this thread a touch, all improvements / mods you just weigh up what it is you want. From the data it looks like the JHM tune is the killer HP gainer for the money spent…Headers seem to be the biggest HP gainer but cost 10-15times plus install as the tune.
Light weight rotors and wheels will for sure help the car be less slow, the JHM pulley does the same for the engine. Seeing that the std pulley can fail does show that sometimes simpler is better. Every decent audi I have driven has had the same engine characteristics, super smooth with power everywhere. That stock flywheel will aid in that silkyness - but as everyone tends to say about these V10s they are almost too good, too smooth.
If anyone has done the pulley and could give a pre and post review throw it up - but to round it off, every single person that wants performance and has done the JHM tune states its the sh*t and no other tune appears to touch it. Jhm are a pleasure to deal with, there new IM and spacers worked wonders on my car.
Well honestly, we’re not talking about a serpentine belt; there’s only one accessory that’s driven by belt… The LW Pulley from JHM is also counterbalanced at (I’m assuming), the correct point to offset the harmonics from the main counterbalance. I’ve done full LW pulleys on various cars for years and while the comment is correct that it adds zero to a dyno sheet, the effects on throttle response can sometimes be pretty dramatic. IMO, if you’re going to be replacing the tensioner and belt anyway, might as well replace the pulley while you’re there too. YMMV.
Having said that, I’m sure there’s way more seat of the pants feel beit to going to lightweight wheels and brake rotors. Both of those will net 25-30lbs off of the unsprung weight of the car - which is well, huge.
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I think I wrote a before/after review in my ownership saga thread. I’ll look to see if I can find it.
edit: Found it…
You may also want to check the seal behind the crank pulley before install as it seems mine is going to have that seal replaced while the car is with JimmyBones.
Apologies for derailing thread…
No problem. I appreciate all the comments and opinions.
I have decided that for now, I will just stay stock. My car is running good and I don’t want to rock the boat. In stock form, the car has plenty of power and is fun as hell.
I’m sitting with you at the mo. When you or I are going to go for it, it seems the jhm tune is the only selection to make.
IMHO its simple.
JHM is proven not just with the S6 and S8 but with ALL of the NA Audi motors. APR the next popular brand isn’t even close and when I say not even close I mean not close like solar system not close.
JHM has over .8 faster and in some cases 7mph or more of a difference between them and the competition in acceleration testing.
When you look at it JHM holds by a large amount the fastest
B6 A4 3.0 Na 1/4 mile record for both auto and manual
B6 S4 4.2 Na 1/4 mile record for both Auto and manual
B7 S4 4.2 NA 1.4 mile record for both Auto and manual
B7 RS4 4.2 Na 1/4
B8 S5 4.2 Na 1/4 record
S6 5.2 1/4 mile record
S8 5.2 1/4 mile record.
As it that wasn’t enough they are still actively supporting our platform.
I never link to troll zine but you can’t argue with this one poll. I know its not from S6 owners but it helps prove a point.
http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php/402306-Chips-Poll-with-customer-review
Did anyone measure 0-60 before and after JHM tune? I did not realize how slow our cars are compare to others. I never really raced with anybody, but last weekend did a few pulls with my buddy’s manual stage 1 Mazda 3 speed. Besides tune he only has an exhaust and downpipe. He literally pulled away from me from any speed, besides deadstop.
My s8 is all healthy now with fresh intake manifold and spark plugs, so i thought its much faster than it really is haha
I know these cars are in very different leagues, but still, feel disappointed…
No tune, stock is only about 5.5ish seconds to 60 for the S6 and S8. Not the fastest at all. A v10 M5 is about a full second to 60 faster. To me, it always seemed like the purpose of these cars was not to break record speeds or anything. They seem to be more of a luxury, V10, GT cruiser. Still sporty but much with much more focus on smoothness and comfort than say again the M5 V10. That’s how I see it at least.
Stock S6 cars and S8 cars are FUCKING SLOW like 14.3 seconds slow. This was when lots of companies were playing the paper acceleration game and fudgeing acceleration figures.
The S6 and S8 are slower than reported by the factory and they have been caught by several car mags for there false reporting. and or not being able to have those times repeated or come even close. Several members here a few years ago took there very well running cars to the track and the times were less than steller.
Your S8 is probably untuned a low 14second car. JHM tuned its a mid to low 13 second car. After you JHM tune go you from getting beat by a mazda 3 to keeping up with RS4s.