If it is the 1650, yes. 1900…no I’ll stick with my $12,500+ theory.
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Ya first week of march I think that info will be public.
Ya first week of march I think that info will be public.
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^^ this
Considering the bores on the 1650 are the same as the 1320…I’m pretty sure that’s the 1900. Besides, the 1900 screws have gotta be cheaper to produce than the nonexistent 1650 screws.
And yes, salmon, as boost level rises, the power spread between pump and race gas will grow…but for sure we’re not tapped out on 93 yet. But running 20 psig at very retarded ignition advance, id guess, wouldn’t be the huge power jump everyone’s expecting.
Don’t forget the big blower could add a lot of weight, plus its way up high where it’s not ideal for handling…turbo guys don’t take as much of a hit in this regard with upgrades. So it’s not for everyone, that’s for sure.
Looks like we may get some news this weekend per Arin, on that other site… You going to give us the inside scoop here on AR, Arin?
dunno…I reckon he’ll hit the dragstrip with the stage III B8 S4 this weekend and will tease that video/result to the forums. Just my thoughts.
Pricing, specs to follow.
p.s. the average price guess (excluding Arin’s joke guess of $17,500+) is
$10,769.23
That would be cool but I don’t think that will be the case… Kind of risky since his car is 6-speed… If they go and don’t run much better than 11.6 than people would say the kit isn’t worth it, sucks, etc. etc. Obviously, the folks that have a clue will look at the trap and not ET but still kind of risky IMO… I bet they will show a B8 prototype and disclose what blower and such… I guess will see in a few days or hopefully sooner…
^^^good point. That’s the gamble. Arin could have gone to the strip when stage II at some point to give an idea of delta, but it’s too easy to say he sandbagged the ‘before’ results. Our quarter mile databases paint a pretty telling picture of the ‘before’ with stage 2 APR guys at the strip though, so not sure he needed to go.
Still, if he goes stage 3 and runs 11.6 @ 122 or something, I don’t think anyone’s going to say ‘it’s not worth it’. Consider that
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NOBODY has gone 11s on pump gas, be that a DSG or 6 speed. 11.6 would be a dramatic improvement. It would be 6 tenths faster than the pump gas record.
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NOBODY has trapped anywhere near 123 on any fuel in a B8 S4
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NOBODY has run anywhere near 11.anything in a 6 speed car in any configuration
So I don’t think it’s as risky as you think. The bar is pretty low. When you take the DSG awaay from the B8 S4 it’s quite a different story. I used to be a big proponent of the manual B8 but the DSG just absolutely RAPES the MT cars.
Fastest Manual B8 S4 times on pump gas (the benchmark Arin would be up against). I need to add richib86 back in, but I think he’s around the same as squattro4.
Edit: added richi
http://i375.photobucket.com/albums/oo193/sakimano/B8pumpmanual2_zps98c134ff.jpg
Saki, While I agree with your points, I think you overestimate the intelligence level of most on the forums especially AZ… They will just look at the times Ryan, Bear and I have run and compare to them with disregard to fuel, DA, trap, etc. Look at the EC header post that is out there now… EC drops a dyno sheet in there and everyone is all about the headers, no one takes the time to research and understand that there is NO way these make the claimed power… IE no one looks at the same day, same track, same gas comparison that was done by Imola and I, instead they look at the vendors dyno #'s… Maybe I should go post in that thread with some real world results, how long do you think it would take before A) my comments get deleted and/or B) I get banned or an “infraction”? lol
I do realize Arin and the APR team did us a solid by taking the RS5 and S6 to the strip and posted real world #'s along with dynos to support their product… However, with the S4 there is so much more data out there that they are better off just posting dynos, especially given the car is a 6-speed… I’ll bet you a coke we don’t see stage III S4 strip times until the blower is released and I install it on my car… bet?
Oh and don’t forget EC has already trapped 120.84! Gotta be the headers! lol
There’s so many variables, who knows what’s a representative time that people consider an “improvement”. I think everyone, even here, is a little optimistic. For me, strapping on stage III on a fully loaded 4000+lb DSG car and doing 11.9@117 on pump would be pretty massive, and a .4sec/4mph improvement above that on race would be massive.
FWIW there are other places that haven’t been explored fully:
-better HFCs for one (although AWE said negative I guess)
-the extra 200 rpm of top end we’re missing
-having you, Prime, come to a track at sea level…
-TB/intake porting we talked about in the other thread
-being able to launch at 5000 rpm like the RS5 and S6
-optimized cold-weather tuning (still can be improved, looking at logs)
All said and done, having a solid 11-second car in ANY conditions would be what defines amazing for me. I guess you already have that Prime, lol.
I will bet you a Coke, sure. I think Arin will step up. I also think if you had done that in the EC thread, you would not get an infraction, or your comments deleted…but much worse. You would get painted a hater, and people would turn a blind eye to your information. Even though you’re helping save thousands of their dollars, you are a hater.
I definitely overestimate the intelligence level on AZ. It’s not even a lack of intelligence…just the ability to dispassionately look at the facts. That’s hard for anyone to do, since we’re all humans.
For example, if I asked you, apples to apples, what car responds better to mods: The B8 S4, or the naturally aspirated B7 RS4? What would you say? First lets define apples to apples:
Since there’s no DSG RS4, we will restrict ourselves to the manual B8 guys.
Since the RS4 times we have are almost all on pump gas,and same for the B8 manual guys, we’ll just look at those (we’d be throwing out the fastest RS4 all motor time, but that’s ok).
Since both cars are equal stock (12.69 @ 108 vs 12.75 @ 108), if you can disapassionately look at the facts, you would have to say the 4.2 FSI responds to mods than the 3.0T. If I said that on audizoo people would be lining up to call me a B8 hater. People may do so here for that matter. But…let’s look at the facts instead.
http://i375.photobucket.com/albums/oo193/sakimano/B7pump_zps0df11f1c.jpg
http://i375.photobucket.com/albums/oo193/sakimano/B8pumpmanual2_zps98c134ff.jpg
I am a huge fan of both cars and that comparison is great. I also assumed because the B8 S4 was FI in stock form it would have to respond better than the NA RS4 4.2FSI, but when you put things basically in black and white you see a different story. Even comparing the B6/B7 S4 to the B8 will show they respond well to modification maybe even better than the B8 assuming your buying JHM parts.
This kind of talk would light a damn wild fire on AZ…maybe even here.
Rich probably has $7500+ in mods and barely picked up 3 tenths
B6/B7 with a tune (550), IM (1200), DP/exhaust (1300), LWCP(350), LW rotors(550) could pick up almost 6 tenths for around $4000 and still NA…slap on spray and you have the equalizer…and your still under $7000
Disclaimer: obviously I’m assuming every installed by the owner
Nobody likes facts when they conflict with their opinion (or their past purchase decisions)
p.s. the B6/7 picked up big gains (mine gained 9 tenths and 6 MPH for $2900) but starting in the high 13s is different to starting in the mid-high 12s. The B8 and RS4 have a tougher time making gains, naturally.
From the surface that logic sounds right. But when you think about it, it is flawed. your comparing a car that only comes in manual to a car that comes in 98% automatic with a few manuals sprinkled in here and there. Your taking the times from every RS4 out there and comparing it to a few of the Manual S4’s out there who have gone to the track. Not all of them have an upgraded clutch and the ones that did, did not have a very good one. Im not making excuses just saying the manual S4’s are limited by the clutch setups.
So if you want to compare which car takes better to mods you should compare the RS4 times to the DSG S4, that would be a more apples to apples comparison until we have a bigger pool to compare to. You are using one method of measuring a cars performance to gauge a cars ability to respond to mods, when in reality any other race that does not involve launching your car as hard as you can the DSG S4’s are either neck and neck with the manual S4’s or a little bit slower.
Actually the ratio on the forums for the b8 is more like 40% manuals
The rs was super low production. Only 2500 here.
If I were a betting man I would say there are more manual S 4’s then there are RS 4 s
Anyway we have more manual b8 quarter mile results than the Rs 4.
Your point is valid… But it’s valid for the rs4. Despite this the numbers are better.
ya im not arguing your point, but in someones case like mine. I have never been to the dragstrip, all of my racing has been off the dragstrip, and in almost all of those conditions my car is a lot faster than a stock S4.
^^^Actually you were arguing the point, and used a set of justifications that were all wrong. Then you said your car is faster than a stock S4 which means nothing lol.
Your post is kind of exactly what I was talking about. Ignore fact, insert random made up fact and a healthy dose of butt dyno and opinion. Proves nothing really.
Here…
46.6% of the 221 forum members polled own manual b8 and 53.4% are dsg.
http://forums.audiworld.com/showthread.php?t=2784712
Don’t feel like searching, so does anyone know the fastest B8 DSG on pump? Prime, did you ever make any passes on 93?