a tuned S4 doesn’t have to walk away from a tuned RS4. A tuned RS4 should be at least a little bit faster than a tuned S4 for Saki’s point to be true, but it is not. The S4 is either going to be faster or maybe they are even. In either case the RS4 wouldn’t be responding to mods better than a S4 because the RS4 has at least 6oHP more than a S4 from the factory.
Why do you keep talking about launching? the B7 RS4 and B8 S4 (manual) 60’ times are close to identical. Why make an argument for DSGs when some guys like me would never buy a DSG? I would personally only be interested in a manual so DSG info would mean nothing to some people. The DSG obviously makes up the advantage by it’s gearing and perfect consistent shifts.
your getting away from the apples to apples…manual vs manual thing
Actually, my 12.45 time is on there, but the octane needs to be changed to 93.
that’s weird…we are also still comparing the NA 4.2FSI to the 3.0T and how they each respond to mods…I have to say the 4.2FSI competes very well if we look at some of the data we have.
http://www.goapr.com/includes/img/products/dyno/42l_fsi_v8_rs4_vs_30tfsi_b8s4.gif
I agree with that graph. That graph doesn’t prove anything though. The S4 makes more power below 5700 RPM the RS4 makes a lot more power above 6000RPM. I do all of my racing above 5000RPM where my car pulls really hard. But that doesn’t matter because my car isn’t stock and doesnt bleed boost at high RPM’s. Their looks to be a ~50-60 horsepower difference on the top end so I don’t know why you highlighted my 60HP comment.
Also Arins car made something like 460WHP on this same dyno, and im sure in the exact same temperature and humidity. I don’t think a JHM RS4 will come close to that.
That’s exactly what I did. Stock rs4 vs stock b8 s4 is just about dead equal.
The reason i used the manual b8 cars is because the dsg is a real game changer and adds a measure of help that is pretty dramatic. I know you don’t believe it, but the DSG b8 crushes the manual when racing from a dig to 120 mph.
If there was a dsg rs4 I would happily use it. If we see the new b8 rs4 and rs5 get modded maybe we will see a dsg vs dsg comparo.
Also why are you so sure the rs4 cars don’t do well in highway pulls? Ask tsivas27 what happened when he raced a near stock rs4 (it had a few light weight parts but stock tune, stock downpipe, stock catback with different mufflers. Tsivas is stage 2 with a nice mod list. They were door handle to door handle. Both are manual. This was a high speed highway pull.
Anyway I’m not continuing this with you paper. You can’t seem to focus on the facts.
You’re bringing dsg in.
You’re bringing race gas in.
You’re bringing dyno numbers in.
None of it is part of the topic at hand… And the topic was that people can’t seem to just look at cold bare dispassionate facts. People like you. They bring everything into the discussion that is irrelevant in order to not look at the facts presented. Exactly what prime time and I were talking about earlier. AZ style.
This is all a nice thread jack while we wait for arin to spill the beans!
Yup, its on there.
I know the graph doesn’t PROVE anything…just like your dyno, but I posted it for a visual comparison on the same dyno. The difference of the two cars is not as dramatic as your trying to portray. Your argument is basically the RS4 is more powerful “60 more HP” and whatever from the factory…blah blah blah. As we can see on the graph I posted the difference through the whole power band isn’t astounding and by the looks I would give the stock advantage to the B8 S4 (Proven by the stock manual record of 12.69 to the RS4 12.75). Your arguing peak HP towards upper end of the RPM range…where no idiot that understands his car would take it. If I owned a MT6 B8 I wouldn’t shift past 6300 RPMs so any argument of the horsepower difference is pointless and I wanted to nullify that point you made too.
What is comment about Arin mean? 460WHP on what…stage 2 or 3? because there you go again bringing other facts that don’t matter into the discussion. I would personally love to see a full bolt on JHM RS4 (minus the blower of course) and stage 2 B8 MT6 on the same dyno, same day, same time, and both on pump. The S4 wouldn’t touch 460whp…sorry…and then afterwards they should both hit the strip together…maybe even a few roll races for your pleasure and see where each car stands. I think a lot of B8 S4 guys would be surprised.
Please explain to me why you have to be an idiot to rev your car to redline while racing? If you shifted a tuned B8 S4 at 6300 RPM while racing, then you sir are the idiot.
Also Arins car was on the same dyno as the one you posted. It was stage 2. It wouldnt have made 460WHP on another dyno maybe, but it made it on this dyno. I never said his car was on pump.
I said 6300RPM…and shifting at redline isn’t always beinefficienticial, if you don’t understand that then I guess what we are discussing is pointless and you know less than I thought. Answer this, If your power is dropping off dramatically past 6500, but your redline is 7000…are you still going to wind your car out to 7k? or will you shift at 6500 and stay in the “bread and butter” of your power band?
Exactly…Arin’s 460whp meant nothing, but you brought it up…that was my point. He made 460whp stage 2 whatever on race gas (which you keep bringing up)and blah blah blah. Then you said a JHM RS4 wouldn’t come close to that…well that’s great I was never trying to prove it would. I seriously can’t wait until the JHM supercharged RS4 puts down some track times on pump gas. I would be willing to bet that even Stage III B8s won’t be able to touch it…but that is a different discussion all in itself.
Ya the manual b8 s4s on pump on our test track are runnning 11.3-11.4s 60-130 times.
The fresh carbon clean RS4 with JHM LWCP, mani spacers, a drop in intake, catback exhaust and LW rotors, some heavy ass winter wheels ran a 12.19 time I believe.
Not bad and pretty darn close if you ask me. The ~0.8-0.9 secs difference is really not that much.
Paul just had all his JHM goodies installed so we will definitely be doing some pulls etc. I think on pump he will take us by a little. Race gas- I am not so sure. I am fairly confident we can break into the high 9s 60-130 (especially Richi when he straightens out his car). Paul is confident he can break into the 9s on race gas also. We shall see.
Most of the people that are commenting on how they beat an RS4 are full of shit or have run one that is not in tip top shape. I have first hand experience on how carbon and vacuum leaks can affect the vehicle and have dealt with more RS4s than your average B8 S4 owner.
Great info…and it will be great to see a JHM RS4 on your test track to make an even better comparison. I’m not sure why some people have such an emotional attachment to their car like Paper, when other members like yourself can understand the discussion.
I mistyped and had changed it to 6300 before you posted this. My power does not drop off dramatically at 6500 RPM, it climbs all the way to my 7200RPM redline. So you definitely know as little as I thought.
I have an emotional attachment to my car because it is my car. That has nothing to do with me trying to point out the obvious. SInce were comparing 60-130 now. Go look at what a stock RS4 did on the list and what stock S4’s do. Now compare that to the RS4 on his list compared to the pump gas S4 Tsivas mentioned. The RS4 is faster than an S4 stock and slower than an S4 tuned. Therefore a RS4 does not respond to mods better than an S4. That is the point im making.
I am a car dude and above all love Audis. All of them. RS4s are really awesome cars, sound insane and definitely can move, at least the healthy ones. And above all don’t really care if I win or lose. It’s still fun as hell. People get too defensive sometimes.
Dude he was talking about stock s4. Focys!
Paper- the RS4 time is a baseline for a pretty stock car. Stock ecu stock dp/cats on pump. Yeah it has a lwcp, a drop in intake, a catback, jhm Mani spacers and some lw rotors (offset by some heavy ass winter wheels) but it’s a pretty stock car.
His car will be a full JHM badass by tomorrow and after he breaks in his new lw clutch/fw combo - he is returning to retest his 60-130 time. Then you can judge 
I’m not going to argue with you because your points make ZERO sense. i don’t give a shit about your car…we were discussing the power difference of a stock RS4 to stock B8 S4 and you thoughts of a dramatic 60hp difference. I don’t think you can follow this discussion so I will no longer try to debate the topic with you.
lol wtf